One of the greatest ever and one of my favorite players. Where would you guys rank Dirk? I'm thinking probably top 20.
i'd have to see the names on the list, because i have him in the top 20 without thinking too much. i think he, kobe, duncan, kg, and shaq defined a 20-year era of basketball. add in that dirk sort of revolutionized the pf position, and it's hard to keep him out of any "top" list. this is the sixth leading scorer of all-time, an mvp, and an nba champion. career averages of 25/10 in the playoffs. nails.
Top 30 is a joke, but you probably have Ewing, Dr J, Pippen and Chuck on your list. He's behind MJ, Kareem, Magic, Shaq, Duncan, Wilt, Hakeem and Russell for sure.
Going down a quick list of hall of famers I'd put Dirk behind: Kobe, Garnett, Duncan, Shaq, Malone, Jordan, Kareem, Wilt, Magic, Hakeem, Moses, Russell, Erving, Maravich, Baylor, West, and Oscar Robertson, maybe throw in MIkan, Cousy, and Pettit. That puts him at 21! I'd say those guys ^ were above and beyond. There's still a list of tremendous, tremendous players like Jim Pollard, Dave Debusschere, Havlicek, Nate Thurmond, Rick Barry, Walt Frazier, Wes Unseld, Elvin Hayes, Earl the Pearl, Tiny Nate Archibald, Bill Walton, Iceman Gervin, Gail Goodrich, Alex English, McHale, McAdoo, Isiah Thomas, Robert Parish, James Worthy, Scottie Pippen, Clyde Drexler, Charles Barkley, Dominique, Dantley, Ewing, The Admiral, Stockton, Rodman, Mullen, Jamaal Wilkes, Bernard King, Gary Payton, Mitch Richmond, Mutombo, Iverson, and Nash. That doesn't include current guys like LeBron, Wade, Westbrook, Durant, and Curry. Maybe even guys like Carter, Paul, Pierce, Bosh, Anthony, the Gasol brothers, and Ginobili. I think Dirk is at least arguable over anyone after that first list, but probably ahead. I could see some arguments in that first list too, but they're ahead in my book (the old guys are harder to argue obviously).
Dr J's career should only take account his nba career, and then it's not even close. I don't think KG is that close either. Cousy, Mikan and Pettit are hard to judge, so I cede there. Of the last group, only James and Wade are ahead of him.
I'm not certain that Dr. J should not count his full stats, but I left off several big international players (Sabonis) so let's call that fair. I still say Garnett is above him because he affected the game more defensively, but they're very close. I can see an argument. Still that puts him right at that 20-30 line. I could see people sliding him anywhere from 18-35. That's still absolutely incredible.
starting at erving, i start having arguments with the first list. enough to feel like putting dirk in the top 20 isn't a stretch at all. the only active player that can claim to have a better career resume is lebron. durant or curry or both may get there (i'm doubtful on the latter, he seems to have cooled off quickly in terms of "omgwtf" impact). wade...nay.
I'd put these guys ahead of DIrk: Kareem Magic Jordan Russell Wilt Bird Baylor Big O Dream Shaq Kobe KG Duncan Karl Malone Logo Lebron Isaiah Thomas Havlicek Moses Malone The Admiral I'd put Dirk ahead of Barkley, McHale and Dr. J, but he doesn't quite crack the top 20, especially when you look at the big men talent. Top 30 is still one hell of an accomplishment. As far as active players, he's #2 career wise behind only Lebron at this point. Durant might pass him up, but joining GS didn't help his cause. He's had a hell of a career.
i would have dirk over kg and malone, actually. i also don't really know how to evaluate some of the old guys. some of their team accomplishments are inflated due to limited competition. was elgin baylor really better than dirk? i'm not old enough to have seen much of baylor, even in highlight reels.
Dirk has one title over Elgin. And the scoring, and efficiency. The 60's rebounding number were crazy inflated.
didn't baylor win one with the lakers? not as THE guy, but winning nonetheless? anyway, yes, those stats are crazy inflated by pace and minutes played. i asked my dad, he said baylor was awesome, but not as good as dirk, all things considered. and he's like, old and wise and stuff.
Elgin retired half-way through that season. The Lakers said it was the greatest regret of all that team that Elgin couldn't enjoy the Finals win with them.
if the spurs hadn't demonstrated it very clearly already, the mavs are doing it: defense is about players executing a system together and caring about doing it consistently. the lakers have no clue.
