Deandre Ayton Discussion: This Is A Platform I Can't Run From

Tough to honestly root for Ayton.

He's had great games but you just feel like he's capable of so much more.

He's young, mobile, tall, and has a long wingspan. He should be catching and feasting lobs. Shoving centers out of the way and beating them down low. He's way too 'finesse' of a center, which means SOFT and lacking intensity.

You look at Pau and the one big difference between him and Pau is Pau's intensity.

Where is that in Ayton? He should be a league leader in blocks per game. He should be grabbing more rebounds considering the Lakers are one of the worst rebounding teams in the league.

There's no initiative from Ayton to be great. He'll get his easy shots and pad his FG% but if all you're going to get from him is 14/8 and mediocre defense, he's not worth investing in. Put that roster and playing time spot up for someone who you can maybe develop and turn into something better. Ayton, for the rest of his career, will always be the same player.

 

this is all true, but the problem is that getting 14/8 from a starting center (who's been a plus on defense, not a big plus, but a plus) generally costs a lot more than his salary.

 

I see the contracts more of an investment. Ayton isn't worth investing a starting slot and money if he's not going to improve. I was hoping his defense and ability to be a lob finisher would be better playing under the Lakers and LeBron+Luka coupled with his contract situation but it hasn't come to fruition. There's a visible energy shift in how the Lakers play when Hayes is out there vs Ayton. When Hayes is there, players seem to play more freely and the crowd is into it. Ayton is a better player than Hayes but for the Lakers and Luka+Reaves in particular, he isn't a better fit.

If the Lakers can pay a young center $15 million and that center improves every year, it's worth it because they'll develop into something better in your system.

I have no idea what Ayton can provide the Lakers as a center for the next 4-5 years. He's not doing anything they really need him to do other than getting wide open shots due to Luka/LeBron's passes.

 

who is this and how are they acquired. you can pay a first in trade for claxton, who's making closer to 25, but then you've slightly upgraded a position we were ok at and limited your ability to improve in places where we're really deficient.

i also don't look at him as the long-term option. he opts out, we may let him walk, but we may also sign him to a short-term deal that's tradable. i just don't see centers on the market this summer that will be an upgrade and available at the price you suggest.

again, i like goga, but is he really better than ayton? is he going to be available for what we have?

neither is the long-term answer, though, i'd agree.

maybe claxton would be the right play--assuming he's actually available.

edit: i just looked up goga's numbers, and he's still killing it in limited use.

i take it back. i'd take him over ayton.

 

hope he can find his game again when reaves returns

so odd that he's the only one he'd found chemistry with

 

I don't care about what Bulls fans think Cookie, If they don't like Vucevic, I'm sure they would hate Ayton or Hayes.

I don't care about that one play either, what I saw, was Vucevic go up against two younger, more athletic 5's, and outscored and rebounded them both combined. He also dished 5 assists along the way. He sets good screens, he is constantly solid on the defensive boards, and he has a high basketball IQ. I absolutely believe, that we can use a player like that in the post season, I'm sorry.

At the cost of Gabe and Maxi? People can't be serious seeing this a bad idea IMO. it's the exact same 21M expiring amount we'd have, but being used on an actual solid contributor, that can help us in the playoffs.

Like I said somewhere else, I'd trade Ayton to Indiana for Mathurin. The Pacers are looking for a 5, and they offered Ayton a max deal as a RFA in Phoenix. I'd make them give me a 2nd or two, we are giving them a starting 5, they already like, for a kid they don't want to pay. Good deal for both teams.

Now we can keep Rui, add Mathurin and Vucevic, and possibly flip our 31 FRP for more picks. We have addressed a short term need at 5, a longterm need on the wing, and added more draft compensation moving forward. That's a win win scenario for us, and totally doable IMO.

 

the continued insistence that the bulls are going to trade their starting center for expiring contracts (when their starting center is an expiring contract) just baffles me. even moreso than trying to use our expiring contracts to get a center that is, at best, on par with our current centers.

 

" at best, on par with our current centers."

FOH with that noise...That's not true at all. He can shoot 3's, he's a better rebounder and scorer than both, he has the ability to facilitate at 5. A floor spacing, good P&R option, rebounding scorer, that can also facilitate some at that position? He is a superior player to both..hands down. He can also actually play with either of those guys on the court to. They have Smith that they can start at 5. They haven't extended Vucevic either, he can walk for nothing, just like Turner did in Indiana. It's not like the Bulls have all this great leverage here at all. What if HE wants to play for a contender? Again.. we can buy a 2nd rd pick, or pick up one in another move, to throw in the trade.

 

https://pippenainteasy.com/we-finally-know-why-bulls-wont-trade-nikola-vucevic

i'm open to looking at him if ayton opts out and we need another center besides hayes.

a midseason trade for a center to displace an already mentally fragile guy (and ruin our shots at future buyout candidates, plus piss off his agent)?

vuc on his desires, from yesterday:

if vuc is moved, i'd expect it to be for kuminga or as part of a bigger swing for a higher-salaried player. he may then get bought out, depending on destination, at which point we might risk drummonding our big man rotation again.

 

Does anyone think his eye might be really bothering him??????? I've had an eye injury and it sucked, was very debilitating.

 

I don't think Ayton would mind being traded to Indiana at all. He signed their max offer in Phoenix didn't he? Why would that upset his mental state? Why would that deter other buyout candidates ? That's a good move for him and us.

I don't care about that slow plodding stuff either, like I said..you saw what he did against two younger more athletic centers last night. This has always been a perceived knock on the guy, but somehow he's managed to be a starting 5 in this league for his entire career, while avg a double double in 30 plus minutes a game.

Lastly good dude, he's always been about his teammates, he doesn't trash guys and always says the right thing in public. Being a solid locker room veteran is another plus.

 

True but he turned in similar performances before he got injured. I like Ayton actually, I like him and Vucevic as a tandem too. (That’s ideaI) but I also like Mathurin, and I don't think the Pacers would be interested in Hayes and Knecht for Mathurin. We'd have to give them a pick..probably a 1st.