D'Angelo Russell Discussion: Adopting A Professional Attitude

Discussion in 'Lakers Discussion' started by The Original 81, Jun 25, 2015.

  1. ZenMaster

    ZenMaster - Lakers All Star -

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    What did he do? I couldn't stand to watch.
     
  2. ZenMaster

    ZenMaster - Lakers All Star -

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    OK....

    Saw quite a bit of high-mid post up, no...? Very encouraging.
     
  3. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    typical good decisions on the pick and roll (leading to fumbles and missed shots), some strong ballhandling against pressure defenders, couple nice long jumpers, and perhaps most interestingly, he collapsed their d on a few trips by posting burke. long term, this is going to be a weapon. he even finished one of those over gobert.

    of course, he had lots of rookie mistakes sprinkled in, including a couple of really tricking ballhandling ventures that fell apart. still, most of what's wrong with his game looks very correctable, and most of what's right looks pretty unstoppable.

    edit: sorry, didn't mean to reply to myself, but to the question as to what happened in the game.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2016
  4. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    I forgot it was on. Used to make me crazy. Now .... oh well, the highlight are more fun. We actually look good in those.
     
  5. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

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    [​IMG]

    Courtesy GT on LG. Byron Spacing 101. #manup :Laugh:
     
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  6. ElginTheGreat

    ElginTheGreat - Lakers MVP -

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  7. ElginTheGreat

    ElginTheGreat - Lakers MVP -

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  8. wcsoldier81

    wcsoldier81 - Lakers All Star -

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    thanks .

    Always wondered , are there any stats reflecting offensive and defensive efficiencies of a player by taking into consideration the efficiencies of the opponent lineups this player plays against ?
     
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  9. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    I was wondering that the other day. I know stats like adjusted +/- account for the other players on the floor with them (on their side), but I'm not sure it takes the other side into account.

    in this case, though, those numbers are huge no matter who you're playing.

    to your implicit question: I'm guessing roy and kobe are killing the starting units, and the numbers in Russell's favor are largely due to the really bad starting unit (as opposed to the really good second unit).

    also, he's been playing down 30 a lot, and teams naturally let up when that happens. so, yeah, probably nothing to get too excited about. I'm just focusing on the development process. he's getting more assertive on offense, which is what I wanted. it would be nice to see that standing three start dropping some more as the next domino.
     
  10. wcsoldier81

    wcsoldier81 - Lakers All Star -

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    yep ... I was talking in general because lots of b-ball "heads" seem to draw conclusions up from this on and off court things .

    The Whiteside numbers are a good example as Miami is better defensively without him on the floor so :

    - He could drop kind of "empty" numbers or

    - It's a matter of the lineups he plays against and doesn't play against ...

    If he barely plays against bench players , it would/ could make sense the Heat D is a little bit better without him on the floor as it faces weaker offenses
     
  11. ElginTheGreat

    ElginTheGreat - Lakers MVP -

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    Not that I know of off the top of my head, but I'm sure there is some stat guy out there who may know.
     
  12. ElginTheGreat

    ElginTheGreat - Lakers MVP -

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    I'll also add that even when his stats didn't jump out at folks and he was in the starting line-up, the numbers have pretty consistently shown that we play better with Russell on the floor.
     
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  13. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    in whiteside's case, it could also be because dragic is a weak defender and teams run a lot of high screen and roll. i haven't watched him a ton, but the word is that whiteside overhelps to chase stats. in which case he is part of the cause for the poorer defense.

    it's always important to watch, and none of the stats are perfect. some of the circumstances involve so many variables that they basically defy analysis, if only because there aren't enough observations to draw appropriate statistical conclusions.

    i look at stats, but i don't substitute them for logical analysis, particularly in the case of basketball.

    i'm glad the numbers point in russell's direction here, but if they didn't, i'm pretty sure i could construct an argument as to why they're not capturing something that's important.

    and i do think that elgin's right about russell looking good with starters, too.
     
  14. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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    Young fella's not ready. Time for a conversation with Mr. Wood.
     
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  15. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    I played with Magic Johnson and my s*** don't stink. This kid is not Magic Johnson.

    [​IMG]

    Whew!! .... where IS that smell coming from?

    [​IMG]
     
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  16. Weezy

    Weezy Moderator Staff Member

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    Hmm.. Shot at B0ron? I'm gonna say yes.
     
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  17. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

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    After the first or second game in Sacramento, Rondo reached out to Russell post-game. I thought that was cool. I don't mind him using Rondo's edge as an example. Rondo has a competitive desire and wants to win at any cost, and I would like Russell to have that same desire and win at all costs mentality. I see it in him, and I've seen it since his days at OSU. We've even seen at the NBA level. Certain games come to mind (Sac, Minnnesota); he's not afraid of the big moments.

    RE: The Stats: We're a better team with Russell on the floor. He promotes ball movement, he initiates the offense, he recognizes and understands spacing, he operates the pick in roll very well, etc. He's also a very smart cutter. He finds seams within the defense makes the right read and has been the beneficiary of a couple of nice Clarkson/Kobe Bryant passes. The defense will get better once he adds a little size and gets to know players tendencies. Very, very bright future for Russell.
     
  18. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

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    Apparently, Rondo reached out to Russell in high school where they worked out together according to Russell. Didn't know that. Thought that was cool, too.
     
  19. thkthebest

    thkthebest Administrator Staff Member

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    The regularized adjusted +/- stats do take into account the opponents. It takes into account each play / who was on the court / who was on the court on the opposing end / etc. However, with this stat, there is a lot of "noise" so it requires a big sample size to get somewhat reliable data, which is why most RAPM stats (there are many variations) aren't released until later in the season. Also, because of the need for large sample sizes, we can't get this stat for just a 10-game sample. Well, I guess you probably could but I'm not sure if the formula is public.

    I think (not too sure about this) it was first created by a former staff of the Phoenix Suns. At the least, his model was the most popular one. He also created ESPN's RPM, which has a few differences like aging curves, score of the game, etc. At the moment, according to the ESPN version, Duncan has the best defensive RPM. Whiteside is 10th, which is a huge jump from last season when he was 74th. Big men dominate defensive RPM. Kawhi and Rubio are the exceptions, which makes what they do on defense much more impressive to me.

    Edit: Russell used to be near the bottom of the league in RPM. He was below -4. Okafor and Mudiay used to be dead last (around -6). Now, Russell has jumped up to -2.54 while Mudiay is still around -6. Okafor is at -5.21.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2016
  20. KareemtheGreat33

    KareemtheGreat33 - Lakers MVP -

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    Rondo with a shot...hmmm isn't that the epitome of a perfect point guard?
     
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