Anthony Davis Discussion: Only Player On Both All NBA + All Def

Not sure what you mean by "changes everything." That's quite vague. Did Duncan or KG change more than AD?

I've seen him explode last year in the playoffs. He was as unstoppable as anyone I've ever seen. And he was a monster on defense. What more evidence do you need?

 

this is indeed his primary weakness. but again, tim duncan struggled with this for a long time, too.

right. and the idea that he can't explode for huge scoring nights must have just erased...most of his career? he killed the lakers all by his damned self on several occasions. i remember watching those games and just waiting for when AD sat so we could get a lead or get back in the game.

man, those NO teams aside from him were bad. i've said it many times, but it reminds me so much of kg in minny. everybody acted like he wasn't a generational star because he couldn't drag that crap franchise to the promised land with wally szcerbiak as his wingman. good lord.

 

I explained it all to you in my reply, but let me summarize it for you:

1) Changes everything, meaning opposing teams have to change their entire defensive game plan many times just to accommodate one person. Like Shaq. Steph Curry, etc. It's not someone "changing" more than someone, it's the game changing around them to try to stop them more than other star players. I see AD growing into that for sure, not consistently Shaq/Curry levels yet, but it's definitely there.

2) He was unstoppable in the playoffs yes, and that's what some people would like to see on a more consistent basis. Of course, he's playing hurt right now, so we shouldn't expect it so often. But then again, if he can produce like that in the playoffs, that's all that matters! He definitely has that killer instinct, and there were plenty of times last season where we would dump the ball into him and it's almost always an automatic bucket. It's such a luxury. I would like to see him as more of a vocal leader, but of course LeBron is leading that charge for now.

 

Don't bother. Find an NBA forum instead where other fans of other teams will have an objective discussion.

 

There is no history of AD being able to lead a team. If you're asking me would I rather have Luka or AD next to LeBron, I'm taking AD. If you're asking me if I would rather build a team with Luka or AD, I'm taking Luka. AD has had many seasons where his team was decent enough to be a good team but they fell short of that for the majority of his time as the #1 option.

The reason AD was a 'perfect' fit alongside Bron is because we all know AD has no issue deferring to Bron and letting him run the show. Remember, Bron tried to let AD run the show and quickly reverted back to Bron being #1 because the offense became stagnant when AD had the ball. Part of AD deferring to Bron is obviously due to Bron having the experience to lead a team but it's also the limited ability and inexperience of AD being capable of leading a team as well. Contrary to what many of you believe, you can still be a better player than someone while not being the better 1st option player. AD's personality and game doesn't fit being the leader of a team because he can't run the offense the way elite level 1st option players do such as Curry, Luka, Harden. AD is a better player than Harden but Harden is significantly better at running a team. Same with AD vs Jokic. I wouldn't like Jokic with Bron as much as AD with Bron but I'm 100% taking Jokic over AD if I'm building a team because Jokic has shown that he can dominate and run a team as the #1 option.

AD is no Kobe, Shaq, or Duncan. He's more of a Pau Gasol to Kobe or Pippen to Jordan type of player.

Then you have someone here who says they wouldn't take Luka or Steph over AD as if Luka or Steph are some scrubs... That's when you know you're being a homer and not capable of having an objective discussion. Any reasonable basketball (not just a Lakers homer) would have a discussion about why but it's obvious that the person who claimed the above isn't interested in the discussion aspect as much as pushing nonsense.

 

what place is luka's team in? where did they finish last year?

yes, it's clear one side of the floor matters a lot more to you.

hard to say, as duncan never played without another allstar or two, nor did shaq, and when kobe did, his team finished out of the playoffs or was a first round exit. AD won a title in his first season playing with a past-his-prime lebron and a team cobbled together after kawhi pulled the FA rug out from under the team. so...a lot like those guys?

or we have people here who like to strawman? seriously, go dig up the steph and luka are scrubs quotes so you can name the homer perpetrator.

btw, steph's team is in 10th right now, about where they were before he got allstar teammates. guess he's just not an alpha, #1, superstar, dominator.

 

More nonsense and another demonstration of why you aren't reading correctly.

1) Luka is three years in and the roster he has is a total joke with Kristaps being out of the rotation every other day. 43-32 is a very respectable record considering what he was working with and they took the Clippers to six games despite not having Kristaps. You and I both know Luka is going to be a top five player for many years to come. Why do you act ignorant of this? Mavs are likely going to make the playoffs again despite having a dysfunctional roster. Why do you act like Luka is doing a terrible job? No substance in your replies at all.

2) Defense isn't a first option trait. There's a reason why Rudy Gobert isn't regarded as a top 20 NBA player despite being a top defensive player. Would you rather trust Steph running your team or Gobert? Clearly there is a higher weight towards being an offensive talent than a defensive (especially in today's league).

3) Duncan, Shaq, and Kobe created that foundation that led to them being a title contender. Once again, you can't or won't understand the point being made. Duncan, Shaq, and Kobe, you could build and trust your roster around those guys because they can lead a team. AD has not shown he is capable of that which is why him going to the Lakers made a lot of sense because he wouldn't have to worry about leading a team since LeBron is there. You're seriously trying to suggest that it wouldn't be easier to build around Kobe than AD? What exactly are you trying to push here? That AD is just as capable? See, I have 7 years of evidence showing AD can't lead a team and you have nothing substantial to say against that.

4) Your own words is you wouldn't trade AD for any top other star other than Giannis, Kawhi, and LeBron. That means you wouldn't even entertain a discussion for KD, Luka, Steph, Embiid, Jokic, etc., as if they are scrubs... Anyone who isn't a homer would see that those are interesting trade suggestions that would entertain a discussion but you outright ignore it. LeBron+KD wouldn't win chips? LeBron+Steph wouldn't win? LeBron+Embiid? It just shows me you don't want to have a discussion. You're just being, as I've stated, a homer.

5) You're basing KD off his injuries but AD is having a higher rate of injuries than KD... Outside of KD's achilles, which is the main reason they are taking it slow on him, AD has been dealing with more injuries. So far, KD has shown zero side effects from the injuries. You talk about potential with Luka and that you'd trade AD for him but completely stated you wouldn't in another post. You're all over the place. AD is a great player but the league is filled with historically great players right now. You're just saying this because he's a Lakers and not actually having a debate.

 

Who on Dallas or Sacramento should have bothered AD? I get that he is playing into shape and to avoid too much contact, but some scrub big men had career days against him and Drum. So many bad plays look like bad habits right now.

 

this act is getting tired.

read my posts on luka and ask yourself if i'm a luka doncic hater.

well, he's got a max contract and his team is in first place. but i suppose utah's success is all donovan mitchell's, because he dribbles the most.

david robinson was an mvp candidate when duncan joined his team that had already had years of playoff success. then he got to play with two other perennial allstars for a decade. shaq played with kobe and then wade. AD played with jrue holiday for half a season once (that team went to the second round, btw), then won a title with aging lebron.

we have no comparison years for duncan. we do for kobe, though, who, during his prime and without other stars, finished out of the playoffs, 7th, and 8th. or curry. or wade. or whomever. they all lose without other stars. hell, early career shaq had penny hardaway, who was probably a top five player himself at the time.

won't trade for = scrub. got it. thanks again for helping me.

yeah, kd has an achilles injury and isn't as good a basketball player as AD. his advanced numbers this year are worse than AD's from pretty much every year but this one--in which he has played hurt when he shouldn't have.

and i'm not all over the place. you just can't keep up. i wouldn't trade AD for one year for any of those guys. i said i would trade him for luka in the real world, because luka's younger and more durable. it's literally in the thread.

i'd suggest you do this. you're clearly smarter than everyone here, even if only you can see it.

 

AD is a flawed offensive player as your #1: his inability to handle double teams well when he's fully healthy limits him somewhat but then again he's an extremely versatile offensive player who has the ability to both a go to player and a complementary player. Also at his peak, he's one of the best defensive players I've ever seen. His ability to defend wings and be an elite rim protector is really unique.

I don't know yeah he's going to be a 1b to a guy who is at the worst a top 3 player of all time. He did take a NOH to the second round with 48 wins with a decent roster. It's not like even a great player like Durant and Steph did more with equally respective talent. Plus the flaw in his game is one that relatively easy to find in the NBA (i.e he would pair very well with either Donovan Mitchell or Jamal Murray as an example)

 

Still haven't answered my question on whether AD is less impactful than Duncan or KG.

 

yeah--is anyone afraid of denver minus murray? that doesn't mean murray's their best player. it also doesn't mean murray can "carry a team". it means great players need other great players who do other great things in order to achieve team success in a team sport.

as many in this thread have repeated: the argument in itself is silly, much less the specific claim being made by a few.

 

I already did by telling you that's not what I meant by "changed," but I suppose if you want me to rank who's more impactful, it's Duncan > AD > KG, mainly because Duncan has already finished out his career, so we don't know where AD will land. At the same time, I don't see how these comparisons are relevant to the topic at hand, which is deciphering why some consider AD to be a 1B rather than a 1A.

 

I'd pick KG or Duncan over AD. AD is a fantastic player when he is on. But when he is off, its quite bad. He is in the prime of primes. He is a little too soft for my taste but we will find out how he responds in the next couple months. If he helps lead the way to back to back titles, then he will have truly arrived.

 

He's been bad. Just no way around it.

I can't stand Drummond but let's face it the Lakers were better with him and without AD. Just not dominating anything right now.

It's just him getting back in the flow and trusting his body again but man when he grabs his right shoulder you really wonder if he's just done for the year

 

Those guys were durable till the wheels fell off can't really say that about AD for sure. If you're not available you're a zero

 

he's not at 100% and he won't get back to that this season

just shut him down