Talen Horton-Tucker Discussion: Growing Pains

Reaves got him too, close to the basket trying to go up and turned him over.

 

well, one big issue is that we staggered his minutes with russ, too...

he's lost all confidence in his shot, which is unfortunate--though i'd argue he was forced into like, three bailouts at the end of the clock, which isn't the way to bust out of a slump.

his defense has definitely improved since last year. if he can rediscover his offense even just a bit, he'll be worth keeping.

 

I don't understand why he takes contested threes. Is something I noticed and he does at least once per game.
This roster isn't built to maximize him. He will flourish when he's traded, like Kuz, Randle, Russell...

He lacks IQ to ever be a star, I think. But he has game and his physical abilities will probably give him a good career

 

was worried for him on that early bobble, but he definitely seized his opportunity, imo.

 

He NEEDS to develop a consistent floater. He actually nailed the only one he tried yesterday. His downward attack is too predictable because he doesn’t have a counter to his backhand layup. He also needs to develop a mid post jumper. He has totally lost all confidence in his long ball, so why continue with the insanity? He needs to learn from the greats who came before him and steal some moves. I was hoping he would come back this year with a wider range of attack.

 

Yeah I don't get that if he can develop the much harder hard plant and then jump backward to plant and shoot a three, with his handles and body control with the threat to go all the way to the rack .... he can't stop short and go straight up in the mid range area, with the defender on his heals, and shoot short Js with those long arms. Guess the problem is he never frickin' jumps on a J.

 

He has all the in house reference he will ever need from Kobe. Just mimic Kobe’s pull up mid range jumper- just how Kobe studied how Jordan did it. Yes, he doesn’t have their vertical, but the dude has shown he can get up.
It’s not rocket science. It’s repetition, in the gym, working to get better with Handy pointing out the proper mechanics.

 

seems like he's not great at stopping forward momentum for a shot. that's ok, as big-time scorers (e.g., harden) have had similar issues. you said above a floater is the idea, and i agree. the floater doesn't require you to stop your motion and go up.

anyway, he's 21, and it's too early to say what is and isn't possible. he's already made some strides physically and is playing better team and individual defense. maybe at the ripe old age of 23, he'll be really good.

 

I agree. You know I’m not among the group who are ready to give up on him. I totally agree with the ability to stop on a dime.

 

It just occurred to me it was this time last year at the trade deadline, Kyle Lowry for Schroder+THT was on the table but the Lakers declined because we didn’t want to give up THT.

Now here’s the “butterfly effect” moment. If Pelinka accepted that trade, that means Lowry likely signs the same extension with LA that he did with Miami ($26 mil/year for the next 3 years).

That trade would have meant the Lakers never trade for Westbrook so KCP/Kuz/Harrell and our pick are still with us. The Lakers likely salary dump Harrell for a future protected first pick somewhere and have enough under the luxury tax to re-sign Caruso. That means we never chase Nunn either, so we have the MLE who we probably give out to Malik Monk. We still sign Carmelo, Howard, Ariza, Reaves for the minimum. I think in this universe, Stanley Johnson still finds his way onto this team because no other team was really looking at him.


Our roster could have looked something like this at the moment:

Lowry/Caruso
KCP/Monk/Reaves
Lebron/Ariza/Johnson
Kuzma/Melo
AD/Dwight

 

I would have liked your post, but I remembered how much I disliked the events, and it bounced off to the post...

 

well, there's a LOT of speculation there that could have gone other ways.

and i need to see what happens long-term with both lowry and THT. today, it looks terrible (again, massive assumption we keep lowry, who might not have enjoyed the first round exit), but if lowry breaks down for good next year (totally plausible) and THT fulfills his promise, it still looks like the right call.

also, lowry's better than westbrook, but he's not exactly doing great, and i wonder how it would be going here with all of our injuries (we'd be in 7th instead of 10th, probably). and he's even older.

finally, lowry was making 35m last year, right? so schroder's 17 and THT's 1 wasn't going to make it happen. at least one of kuz/kcp had to go then, too.

i don't know. everyone hated kuz last year--i was, like, the only person suggesting that maybe he didn't suck, iirc--and everyone loved THT (there were maybe two people who wanted the lowry trade, max). now everyone hates THT and loves kuz or whatever. i view them the same--solid young players whose value we tanked by putting them in bad spots/improper roles.

 

Still sucked if AD and Lebron are out. Lowry has been either MIA or lackluster this season. Caruso is out 2 months. KCP is still looking for his jumper and Kuz is still up and down. Washington is looking to trade Trez and it's dreaming to think some team would have given us a future 1st rd pick for him. Considering our salary constraints at the end of last season, I just don't see any moves that we could have made to compensate for AD and Lebron missing all this time. This team isn’t bad if the big two are at full speed .

 

the premise was that as it stands, lowry instead of westbrook and THT would make a better team. that's hard to argue. lowry has been much better than westbrook this year, and THT has been, sadly, worse than he was in his rookie year.

i argue with anyone who suggests we could have foreseen all that, though, or that we'd be in a much better position going forward had we made that deal.

hard to say. we're 10-7 with them in the lineup, in mostly unimpressive fashion. this isn't like the clippers from the last couple of years, who killed most people when both their guys were available. lebron/AD/lowry would be a scarier playoff opponent right now than lebron/AD/westbrook.

 

Hard to say..It still takes some time to gell with new teammates, after switching out most of the team. I mean 10-7, scattered around 52 games isn't some kind of solid reference point IMO.

I don't know who will be even playing by the time the playoffs start. Lowry might play well, he may not. Same with Russ, we'll just have to see.

 

I liked Kuz but was fine trading him for the right guy but that's generally my opinion on trades. There are very few guys around the league that I think teams should truly consider untouchable in trades.

THT feels like another in a long line of young guys we aren't going to develop and be patient with.

 

If I'm Rob..I'd trade Talen and a future 1st rd pick, but you gotta take DJ, Baze or Duke too. However, the only way I'm doing that, is if I'm getting a young mobile big in his 20's on a decent contract in return. It's a roll of the dice but a 4/5 or at least a 3/4, with good length in his early 20's, is a worthy gamble IMO.

 

there's a lot of real estate between "trade this guy now!" and "he's untouchable" though. last year, people wanted kuz out and weren't too concerned with the return, iirc. same as THT this year.

ok, sure. young athletic, tall guy who doesn't suck. who's giving us that right now? we could have probably pulled that off last year for THT, but his value is so low now that i can't imagine the team that offers this.