Head Coach Frank Vogel Discussion: The Fall Guy

Discussion in 'NBA Discussion' started by TIME, May 13, 2019.

  1. Wino

    Wino - Lakers Starter -

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    From what I have seen, D'antoni leaves every team he has coached in shambles when he leaves. HIS teams never win. Yeah the Nets have a good chance to win it all this year, but he has almost nothing to do with it.
     
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  2. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    dantoni has a track record of taking bad/meh teams and making them good (but not great). kidd has a record of underperforming his team's talent level.

    btw, budenholzer is becoming new dantoni, who was new don nelson, who was rick adelman's running mate. all seem very good at exceeding low expectations and not so great when it's time to close the deal.

    it's because you have to make roster concessions to fit with his vision. ours was the most awkward of his stops because aside from kobe, our best players were all big. he wanted odom at center, and pau and bynum...i guess dead? his inability to use pau gasol was the nail his coffin for me--this is a highly skilled big who should be effective in almost any situation, and you turned him into an albatross.

    and no, he has nothing to do with the nets' success. as was on display last night, the nets's success is predicated on kd carrying them both in terms of building the team and the on-court product.
     
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  3. SmoothOperator

    SmoothOperator - Rookie -

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    I would love to have Rick Carlslie be part of the coaching staff
     
  4. Weezy

    Weezy Moderator Staff Member

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    I would too, but he’s easily the best head coach available and likely has his pick of any vacancy he wants.
     
  5. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

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    Won't happen. He'll get a coaching gig somewhere else.
     
  6. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

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    Frank isn't a great X and O's guys offensively IMO..

    However, he thrives with communication and collaborating with the players for the most part.

    Harrell probably being the only misstep. .

    Other than that, he's been great.

    Hopefully Kidd leaves, we upgrade the staff, and we're set for the next 2-3 years.
     
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  7. OX1947

    OX1947 - Lakers All Star -

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    I just hope he gets hired again so Stephen A. Smith can blame race for it.
     
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  8. The Rock

    The Rock - Lakers Starter -

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    Credit to him for helping the team be the No. 1 defensive team but Frank needs a lot of help with creative lineup rotations and smallball offensive schemes.
     
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  9. BangBoomPow

    BangBoomPow - Lakers Starter -

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    That was supposed to be Kidd's job, wasn't it? It's tough to evaluate who is responsible for what in coaching because if they do a bad job, it's their fault but what if they were listening to the advice of their assistant coaches? Frank's a great defensive coach but I don't know how much input Hollins, Kidd, Handy, and the rest of the coaches have. You would think Kidd would be a master at it considering he is an ATG PG, though.
     
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  10. The Rock

    The Rock - Lakers Starter -

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    Fair enough but Vogel has been in the league for almost a decade with HC experience. The credit and the fall goes to him at the end of the day. I don't think he maximized our personnel this year offensively
     
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  11. JSM

    JSM - Lakers Legend -

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    Going to need a new lead assistant. Hopefully an offensive mind who will actually use what's in his head. Rondo needs to go ahead and retire and come back.
     
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  12. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    I agree that the buck stops with Vogel, but I can't blame him for how the offense struggled when AD and LeBron were injured, or for all the open but bricked 3 point shots we had in the last three games of the Suns series.
     
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  13. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    That role is often undervalued. Tex Winter was the genius behind the offensive success (scheme wise) of all of Phil Jackson's 11 rings as an example. I don't know who is available or who would be able to energize the offense but there has got to be someone out there.
     
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  14. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    And if someone like that is brought in with new and upgraded schemes, hopefully, LeBron and AD still have to buy in if it's going to change much how they most like to play the game on offense.
     
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  15. DeeZee

    DeeZee - Rookie -

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  16. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    i thought kidd was dead weight on the coaching staff, tbh. he's a figurehead coach, which means he needs to be the head coach with some good technicians behind him. we had the roles reversed a bit, and while i think vogel can handle the leadership aspect and is obviously a great defensive coach, bringing in some fresh perspectives for the offense couldn't hurt.
     
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  17. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

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    You're being too generous with Kidd.

    Anyway, I'm glad he is gone.

    And I hope they put some thought into this assistant coaching hire and promote Handy or something like that.
     
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  18. Barnstable

    Barnstable Supreme Fuzzler of Lakersball.com Staff Member

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    Did Kidd actually do anything while he was here that you didn't like?

    I can’t think of any trouble he caused while with the Lakers, but I’ll always have a little bit of a negative opinion on him from spilling his coffee on the court on purpose that time.
     
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  19. Azndude2190

    Azndude2190 - Lakers 6th Man -

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    It's weird fans around the league hate him, but players, coaches, and executives love him.

    Anyways, his time with us was short and uneventful. Other than that, I don't really have anything negative to say about him and I wish him the best.
     
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  20. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    What I like about Kidd's time here is that he left a positive impression on Vogel. That tells me he was a team first guy and not the backstabber many of us thought he would be in an effort to take Vogel's job.

    Good luck to him in Dallas. I hope he sucks as their head coach and gives Luka one more reason to eventually come play here where he belongs.
     
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