Kyle Kuzma Discussion: Wizard

Discussion in 'NBA Discussion' started by therealdeal, Jun 22, 2017.

  1. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    HA! I did look at the keyboard as I was posting and wondered if it was just you.

    :Laugh:
     
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  2. fabfourlakers

    fabfourlakers - Lakers Starter -

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    Guys - it's plain and simple: Kuz just doesn't play well when both LeBron and AD are playing because he knwos his minutes are not going to be there, and therefore, he plays a bit more rushed and he's got more pressure to perform in those limited minutes.

    If you see, when he plays 30+ mpg, he usually plays really well. When he plays under 30 mpg, he does not.

    He's only going to get those minutes when either AD or LeBron are sitting.

    He is our LeBron/AD insurance - i've been saying it all year.

    Problem with that is we need him to be our 3rd guy too - and that just isn't possible. Our 3rd guy needs to be a PG/SG - not someone that plays the same position at LeBron/AD.

    We need to package Kuzma/Green and get Derozan, Lavine, or maybe go even bigger and try for a Dame, CJ, Booker, Beal type.
     
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  3. BangBoomPow

    BangBoomPow - Lakers Starter -

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    This is simply not true. It's actually backwards. Kuzma gets more minutes when he plays well. He doesn't play well because he gets more minutes. Frank Vogel has no issue playing Kuzma 30 minutes when he plays well. The problem is, when he doesn't play well, playing him for 30 minutes is an absolute disaster for us. Kuzma is known as a scorer. He's actually getting almost as many shots per minute than he's gotten his first two seasons. The difference is, we are a championship contender. We don't have the time or patience to fix Kuzma's mistakes while he's out there. If he can't perform, we need someone else to step in. People talk about Kuzma's defense. Well, if I earned $0 in 2018 and $1 in 2019, does that make me rich? No, it just means I made more than nothing. In Kuzma's case, any defense he played would have been an improvement. Kyle Kuzma is shooting 27% from three the past 30 games. That is no small sample size and is a very alarming stat considering Kuzma came into the league shooting 36% from the field. He's just not a good shooter. What I do like about Kuzma lately is his spin move to the basket and his floater. The problem with that is it's not always going to be there for him. Kuzma wants to play like Kobe but he's closer to playing like Adam Morrison.

    You earn minutes when you play well. Kuzma has simply not played well. When we have Bron+AD+Dwight on the court, that's already three players who can't really shoot. When you add Kuz, you then have four players who can't shoot. You simply can't play a line-up with those four and that is where Kuzma has to be benched and receives fewer minutes. Now, imagine if he was hitting 36-38% of his threes and could actually play defense? This young man would have earned himself a very nice contract and endorsement deals when we win the championship. Instead, he will be shipped off to the Cleveland Cavailers and be a journeyman for the rest of his career.
     
  4. tada

    tada - Lakers All Star -

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    I was never really a fan of this kid, but man, has he fallen off a cliff. He looks terrible out there.
     
  5. fabfourlakers

    fabfourlakers - Lakers Starter -

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    Nope - you are actually dead wrong. We have literally only played Kuzma 30 minutes or more EIGHT TIMES this entire year!!!

    Wanna knwo his averages in those 8 games?

    23 & 6 on 51% FG and 41% 3PT

    The problem is that Vogel has simply not played Kuzma enough and that is because we have AD, LeBron, McGee and Dwight eating up majority of the frontcourt minutes. Kuzma needs to play in order for him to find that rhythm but we're treating him like a role player - he can't be that 3rd guy for us because he simply doesn't play enough minutes. Look at all the best 3rd options in the league -they're all well above 30 mpg. Kuzma is at 25mpg...big drop off from last year where he played 33(!!)mpg.

    Vogel has to find more time for Kuzma - and he hasn't so far. It's not that he would "love" to play him more - the guys that Kuzma is fighting for minutes are our 2 best players - and that is part of the reason why I think he needs to go because he's not going to be successful playing with them - he only really plays well when one of the two are NOT Playing or BOTH are not playing (his best game of the season came on the road against OKC without Bron AND AD).
     
  6. tada

    tada - Lakers All Star -

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    I think he's playing enough as a 6th man. Lou Williams averaged 26 minutes last year and 29 minutes this year. Jordan Clarkson, who's having a career year, is playing 25 minutes. Same goes for Rose, Dragic, and Harrell. All 6th man of the year candidates.

    I think we are giving him too many excuses. He's played poorly in his role. And frankly, he's not good enough to get starter minutes on a championship team, which means he can only thrive on a low-seed playoff team or lottery team.
     
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  7. BangBoomPow

    BangBoomPow - Lakers Starter -

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    You didn't read correctly. Your reasoning is backward. If Kuzma plays well, he will get more minutes. That's why the minutes he plays has a lot to do with his efficiency. When he's efficient out there, Frank gives him more minutes. If you do the math, Kuzma shoots the same shots per minute as his 1st and 2nd season. The number of shots he gets isn't the issue here. If he plays poorly, Frank doesn't give him more minutes because he's a liability defensively and offensively. "We played him 30 minutes or more EIGHT times this entire year." Yeah, and we would play him 30 minutes every night if he didn't suck for the first 29 minutes, duh?
     
  8. Punk-101

    Punk-101 - Lakers Starter -

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    In other words, he’s only played well 8 times. :Rondonod:
     
  9. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    i'm not sure the causal direction of his minutes and production is fully settled, but i do know that if you play the same positions as lebron and AD, you have to thrive in fewer minutes. maybe kuz isn't that kind of player. maybe we end up trading him for a player who is and to a team that needs a 30+ mpg secondary scorer (or someone to sell tickets). in other words, swap him for a tony snell type and a 1st to a team like detroit.

    oh wait--tony snell plays for detroit, and kuz is from near there...
     
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  10. fabfourlakers

    fabfourlakers - Lakers Starter -

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    tony snell would be selling Kuz WAY short though...

    I think we're in agreement that Kuz playing the same position as LeBron/AD is a huge factor in his minutes being limited and more pressure on Kuz to perform in the minutes given cuz he knows he will get yanked the second he makes a mistake.
     
  11. Savory Griddles

    Savory Griddles Moderator Staff Member

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    I brought up this potential trade a month ago. It is a good deal for both teams. We'd probably have to throw in our first from this season's draft (ie we pick for them, then trade). It gives the Spurs young assets to help jumpstart their inevitable rebuild. We get a 20 ppg scorer in a position of need.

    The main two problems I see though is:

    1. DeRozan may opt out after this season to get a longer term deal, at which point we wouldn't want him (his expiring deal is part of the appeal)

    2. Pop is a petty little b****.
     
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  12. JSM

    JSM - Lakers Legend -

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    Maybe we can convince him to hold out a year in exchange for a ring + him being a huge Kobe fan, maybe he'd want the opportunity to play in the house that Kobe built.

    Pop does like Kuz from his brief stint with Team USA, so maybe that'll help.
     
  13. Wino

    Wino - Lakers Starter -

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    Hmmm, I hate to feel this way but the evidence suggests it may be true. I think the Lakers resign him for a huge pay increase and THEN trade him.
     
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  14. BangBoomPow

    BangBoomPow - Lakers Starter -

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    We don't need more 6'5-6'6 guards who weigh under 220. We have Danny Green, KCP, and Alex Caruso to cover that. We need a 6'7-6'9 SF/PF who can guard big wings such as Kawhi, PG, Giannis, KD.
     
  15. karacha

    karacha Moderator Staff Member

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    I thought we got one?
     
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  16. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    i'm not the president of the tony snell fanclub or anything, but i'm not sure it's WAY short, tbh. and that's why we'd get the first round pick.

    anyway, something like that.
     
  17. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    Is Morris quick enough to get a few minutes and some physical play on PG or Leonard? Probably not I'm guessing. Or?

    I was surprised to see him listed as a SF in one article the other day. He's a PF isn't he?
     
  18. BangBoomPow

    BangBoomPow - Lakers Starter -

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    That would depend on if small-ball is being used. They could play PF if so but if other teams go big, he could transition to SF as well.
     
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  19. Savory Griddles

    Savory Griddles Moderator Staff Member

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    We didn't think you were. That's a significant position that requires all your effort and energy to lead that many people. You seem more like it's Secretary of State.
     
  20. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    it's sort of like this:

    https://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/mr-belvedere-fan-club/n10256

    i *should* want to get tony snell's autograph.

    i *shouldn't* want to lay in a bed of his recently game-worn socks.
     

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