Anthony Davis Discussion: Only Player On Both All NBA + All Def

I believe Lebron demands a trade out if the Lakers don’t trade the kids for AD. Since we can now frame arguments on conjecture, I think that’s a reasonable belief. Therefore, not only do I believe we won the trade, but we HAD to make the trade or else we lose Bron. Did I do it right?

 

I believe that is right about LBJ... which is why in retrospect I think we might have been better pairing off PG with another player and the core.

At the time you don't say no to LBJ under any circumstance so I get why we did it.

The key now is whether we sign LBJ to an extension if he continues his slow decline.

IF we don't sign LBJ after he declines... I feel very optimistic about pairing another star with AD... who wouldn't want to play with him.

If we sign LBJ to a farewell tour extension when he declines like Kobe... then we might be in trouble.

I also can envision LBJ making the transition to a pure Magic like point guard... if he continues on that path... maybe we will be fine as Magic never had much athleticism and I think LBJ can do that role in his old age.

Those are two positive possible outcomes and one possible negative.

I think that's fair. Hopefully one of the positive outcomes happens.

 

Like (love it or hate it [as many have]) clearing cap space for the 3rd superstar in Leonard to pair with James and expected Klutch assisted 2nd superstar Davis? How did we have cap space to have him come in if it wasn't freaking "engineered". Again we were under a microscope and in no way shape or form could risk a third tampering infraction.

 

Did we clear cap space in well thought out manner? Or did we get rid of some valuable assets at the last minute to make room?

I remember the latter happening.

The reports of the Clippers following Kawhi around all season were well documented. All we needed to do was follow suit. The Clippers remember got fined for tampering when Doc praised Kawhi.

 

See that's why many here dislike the way you argue your points. Totally moved away from MY bone of contention in this exchange of you ridiculously stating that our attempt to land Kawhi Leonard was a last minute Hail Mary effort. And then throwing more on the arsonist fires you like to ignite ... say that even if Leonard had signed with us to create that most amazing of teams we took a great shot at creating .... that it would have been sheer luck by our FO.

 

nope. time will tell what weird twists of unforeseen fate might get in the way of what was an outstanding, no-brainer move.

where do i start?

he was drafted 48th, i believe. which doesn't matter. he had already been spanish league mvp, and other players with similar resumes had been quite successful (nocioni, navarro, scola), and he was only 19. he was stupidly overlooked, and both the lakers (because our scouting has been very good for a long time) and grizzlies (because he's pau's brother) knew it. the fact that casual fans and morons in the media didn't know is immaterial.

by your logic, he was way more than our #4, because i'm almost certain that the #4 draft pick this year will have an inferior career to marc gasol's.

of course, i disagree with that logic in principle. if i agreed with your logic, i would again turn it upon you (this is fun, actually) and suggest that BECAUSE NOBODY KNEW WHAT MARC GASOL WAS then we had no choice but to say the jury was out on that pau gasol trade until...i guess whenever marc gasol retires? and i mean, we can't RULE OUT a kwame brown comeback. he MAY HAVE been working on his steph curry three for the past few years and will return to the grizzlies to pay his debt and lead them to a championship.

YOU NEVER KNOW! do you? i mean, you can't!

man, the context. pau was considered a flop in memphis, despite his production. he'd been on the trading block for a couple years. dallas refused to give up josh howard for him. chicago refused to give up deng for him. only AFTER he was traded to the lakers did everyone start screaming that there was a great market for him. nobody wanted to pay max money for him as a cornerstone, or if they were, they didn't want to give up assets for the privilege.

more to the point: he wasn't anthony davis, for whom one franchise (boston) spent years amassing assets in hopes of trading them all. furthermore, expiring contracts were more valuable back then, and we ate all of pau's salary, which allowed them to sign zach randolph.

i find it quite funny that you're using a trade that actually looks pretty good for memphis in retrospect (because you love retrospect) to make your point about this one. people thought they were robbed! but they weren't, it turns out. people think the lakers overpaid for AD! but they didn't, it turned out.

yes, him and whatever else it took, we were going nowhere with those parts, just like NO if zion isn't a superstar. and before you go there: NO, whatever zion becomes has NO bearing on whether the AD trade was good.

an indeterminate length of time, decided by you, whenever it looks like something might be breaking in your argument's favor. like suddenly talking up lonzo's 4 good games when it's been AWFULLY quiet on that front for the other 30.

tiresome.

 

you mean the team that lost in bucketfuls and started winning when its best player came back might be winning due to said best player? yeah. i will be saying that. silly me.

i know you're addressing fabfour--but just to reiterate, i would never say that. i don't care what they do elsewhere, they didn't and weren't going to do it here. they were not and will not be worth an mvp candidate in trade.

 

LET IT GO, do not engage...

 

Nocioni 10.5 PPG
Navarro 10.9 PPG lasted one season
Scola 12.0 PPG

Funny how when you use players to prove your point they are "quite successful" yet our young players are downplayed with superior numbers

Funny how Pau is a flop when he won more games than AD in Memphis... 50 one season and 49 the next, as well as making the playoffs three times in row. (And yes, AD is a better player)

I had thought Lonzo was done too... but all of a sudden like Ingram's rise last season... these games come out of nowhere.

How many thought Ingram's six games last year were a fluke?

I'm just wondering what it will take for people to admit another outcome is possible...

Pelicans making the playoffs? Zo continuing to average over 15 PPG the rest of the season? Ingram continuing his pace the rest of the year?

Face it... even if BI averaged 30 PPG next season and Zo averaged 20, you'd say the trade was a no brainer.

 

The trade was a no brainer; we had to do it.

Once LeBron was signed, that was it.

It's nothing against BI or Zo; it was just a move the Lakers neede to bring in another all NBA player and Bron's buddy..

However, if you're arguing we gave up to much draft compensation (in the trade), I would listen to that; much more than the existing players who we traded for Davis because that really didn't bother me.

Not having a 1st this year sucks to trade; that bothers me...

 

Except they've now played well for 9 games before Zion showed up against tough competition.

If they excel in New Orleans, there's no way you could know whether they would have excelled here.

 

My standard for a successful trade last season was to keep one of BI/Zo/#4... if they said no I would have walked... but I agree because LBJ we had no choice.

Yours is keeping more or one draft assets.

Don't think we are that far apart.

 

I'd say 2 of those guys had successul careers. Noicioni and Scola were important role players on playoff teams multiple times in their careers. Might want to look at more than just PPG. Did you know Jimmy Jackson once finished 5th in scoring? Was he ever close to a top 5 or even top 10 player? No. PPG is not a direct correlation to success.

abeer didn't actually call Pau a flop in Memphis. He said he was largely considered one, which is 100% true. He was considered a faux All Star because he was 0-12 in those 3 playoff appearances. Nobody cares if you win 50 games a season when you don't win a playoff game.

There is no possible outcome where this was a bad trade for the Lakers. If Ingram and Zo pan out for New Orleans, then it was a win-win. If the Pelicans make the playoffs, Zo averages a triple double, and Ingram averages 30PPG the rest of the way, I'll be happy for the kids and root for them against anyone but the Lakers. I'd still rather have AD 100 times out of 100.

 

I remember them... not Navarro... and they were decent players... but I was amused at how abeer had such kind words for those players

Of course I understand that PPG isn't everything... but when people are discussing things quickly it becomes a shorthand to put things in perspective.
Since none led the league in other categories, I figured it was as good as any to provide context.

My argument wasn't that Pau was good in Memphis... my point was that he won more games with not much better help.

You like the trade... I can't argue with someone's preference... and I respect your good wishes for our ex players

All I know is that I would personally would have been more cool with it if we had kept one of BI/Zo or #4... if we hadn't dumped young assets like Zu, Bryant, Svi, Mo, Bonga

I don't think that makes me a raving madman.

 

All he said was "quite successful." You're making it sound like he raved about how great they were. Two of those guys combined to play almost 20 years in the league. That's quite successful for most of the league.

In regard to PPG, you might think it puts things in perspective, but it doesn't. If we're just comparing PPG, then Lonzo Ball = Juan Navarro. That doesn't sound right does it?

Might want to look at those Grizzlies rosters again. Not world beaters, but I'd say those rosters were better than what AD had.

You'd have been more cool with it if we kept BI/ZO or #4? Dang I wish someone told Rob because he's such a dunce that he threw in the extra asset for no reason. It's not like the last time we held out for a star he changed his mind. Oh wait, we caused PG to change his mind because we got Lebron? Or wait? What was it? I dont even know anymore because none of this makes sense.

 

Takes two to tango Weezy and if you go back I usually said it in direct counter to someone else's opinion.

So if I'm a madman then...

 

I've stayed away from Meat for a while now. But overall, he has no clue what he is talking about 90% of the time and his arguments are just as bad. Only way to minimize it is to ignore it. But I will chime in once a week to remind everyone.