Lonzo Ball Discussion: Bulls

Discussion in 'NBA Discussion' started by OmarE, Jun 22, 2017.

  1. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    12,159
    Likes Received:
    18,507
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Professor of Humanities
    Location:
    Orlando
    Offline
    I'm saying you have to earn the minutes, too, and you have to make the most of those minutes you receive. And if you're going to denigrate one player's achievements because of a higher usg, you can't use low usg as an excuse for another. I don't watch the Lakers, and I don't lose any sleep over Ball's performance.
     
  2. karacha

    karacha Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    8,637
    Likes Received:
    27,992
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Online
    He is showing improvement in general, but he does need to learn how to penetrate better. Work on that with Rondo. In fact, he should be better than Rondo in this aspect of the game, since he is faster, taller and more athletic. It has to be mental.
     
    JohnnyComeLately2k6 and TIME like this.
  3. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Messages:
    28,475
    Likes Received:
    62,061
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    I mean Lonzo played 33 minutes as a rookie so he's actually being demoted. It's not like he has never played 30 minutes consistently, he did it his whole rookie year so it's not really similar to Randle or D'Angelo. Those guys didn't earn the minutes, Lonzo already has.

    I don't think we're very far apart on this. I think Lonzo actually has shown growth in his development by becoming more efficient. That was literally the biggest complaint of his game last year. In fact if he were given the same opportunities as last season but with greater efficiency, he has one of the most stellar seasons from a rookie in the NBA. He's doing nearly that now as a sophomore through 10 games.

    I do agree that I'd love to see him more aggressive, but his lack of aggression doesn't make him a bust, it doesn't mean he stinks, and he's still one of the better guards in the game right now. The reality is we're losing so everything looks more negative. You bring up his stats of the last 5 games and I agree they need to be better, but again he's only playing 25 minutes a night. Does more minutes mean more productivity? The limited sample we have says yes.

    In the two games he's played over 30 minutes this season he's averaging 13 ppg 6 rpg 7 apg and 3 steals on 53% shooting and 42% from deep. We're 1-1 in those two games with the loss being the overtime loss to San Antonio.

    I know we all want him to be aggressive and take over games, but that's not really typically what he does and never has been. He just wins games with the right plays. Our team looks best typically when he and Josh Hart are on the floor because we're getting good instincts and the right plays.

    I'd give him a B- right now if we're talking about @tada 's scale. :D

    He's got room to grow for sure, but I'm always shocked at how little people appreciate what the kid is capable of doing. Of all the kids, he's still been maybe the most impressive which might have more to do with the other kids than Lonzo, but still something to think about.
     
    TIME, wallangong, tada and 2 others like this.
  4. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Messages:
    28,475
    Likes Received:
    62,061
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    I honestly cannot possibly agree with him being a disappointment relative to any draft class. Regardless of Tatum and the kid in Utah doing really well, there's nothing disappointing about 10/7/7 with elite defense at the guard position. I'm sorry, but the conversation sort of stops right there for me. If you can't acknowledge what the kid is capable of, then the analysis of his play is negatively tinted.

    I'm fully in agreement he needs to be more aggressive, but I also think what he brings is difficult to quantify. The same qualities people love about Josh Hart, Lonzo does better. That bugs me.
     
    Toklat, TIME, Weezy and 4 others like this.
  5. karacha

    karacha Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    8,637
    Likes Received:
    27,992
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Online
    People probably expected more from Lonzo and less from Hart, that's all. But yeah, Zo is one of the better pure point guards in the league. Which is why I don't quite understand why Luke is experimenting with him as a SG. A scoring guard needs to be aggressive and that's not exactly Ball's strength at this point. He needs to be developed into a better Rondo right now.
     
  6. sirronstuff

    sirronstuff - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    31,726
    Likes Received:
    77,090
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Your time is running out Ham
    Location:
    Laker Purgatory
    Offline
    sayit.png
     
  7. Big Mamma Jamma

    Big Mamma Jamma - Rookie -

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2014
    Messages:
    940
    Likes Received:
    2,880
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Offline
    I actually think Lonzo is doing fine. I love his D and how he sees the game, which is an absolute joy to watch. Whether fair or not, the comparisons to Hart and Kuzma's development in my opinion are just not fair. Those guys were in school longer and had the opportunity to develop. Hart is more well-rounded than Kuz. Kuz, for how athletic he is does not rebound or play D as well as Lonzo.

    I think the league talent has increased so much that it will take longer for guys to develop because the level of competition is so much greater. The problem is that fan bases don't have the patience to wait for the day when a young guy turns into a franchise player.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2018
    TIME, karacha, lakerjones and 3 others like this.
  8. fabfourlakers

    fabfourlakers - Lakers Starter -

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,592
    Likes Received:
    8,175
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    He needs to be more aggressive...that's my only complaint with him.
     
    John3:16 and Cookie like this.
  9. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    36,599
    Likes Received:
    60,835
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    So Cal
    Offline
    What's the best theory why he doesn't take it inside to the rim more often, considering he's fast, quick, taller than guys and by appearances bulked up nicely up top and I assume is stronger in his legs?? I don't want to say it but is he a wuss and just doesn't like the contact? Seems like he could do 75 - 80% of Hart's proficiency laying it in with either hand with his personal set of physical attributes.


    :KobeConfused:
     
  10. alam1108

    alam1108 - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    13,585
    Likes Received:
    37,190
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Laker Land
    Offline
    Cause he's shooting 50% on free throws? I got nothing.
     
    TIME, abeer3 and sirronstuff like this.
  11. fabfourlakers

    fabfourlakers - Lakers Starter -

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,592
    Likes Received:
    8,175
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    Only way he's going to get better at FT's is shooting more of them...getting used to going to the line basically
     
  12. Khmrp

    Khmrp - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2016
    Messages:
    12,135
    Likes Received:
    13,854
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    maybe never had to do at the rate say a Hart or Kuz did in their younger days? Seems like Zo O is either cutting off-ball or shooting 3's, his mid-range and floater gm stink
     
  13. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    36,599
    Likes Received:
    60,835
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    So Cal
    Offline
    Hart doesn't really have a floater either though and rarely decides to try to dunk the ball. Just is so good with his body control and taking contact and then laying it up with either hand. Zo should be able to do a lot more of that as well.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2018
  14. Battle Tested20

    Battle Tested20 Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    9,213
    Likes Received:
    24,866
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Technical Data Analyst
    Location:
    Fair Oaks, CA
    Offline
    The first few times I was like that is just some crazy coincidence, but then this happened today. WTF is going on bball gods..



     
    abeer3 and sirronstuff like this.
  15. sirronstuff

    sirronstuff - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    31,726
    Likes Received:
    77,090
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Your time is running out Ham
    Location:
    Laker Purgatory
    Offline
  16. vasashi17

    vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    6,591
    Likes Received:
    20,201
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline


    I bet it was Rondo...cause he's an a**hole that wants that starter spot...

    No wait, I bet you it was Lance... It's been a minute since he's busted a move and he's looking to do the FoxTrot on Saturday.
     
    LTLakerFan likes this.
  17. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    36,599
    Likes Received:
    60,835
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    So Cal
    Offline
  18. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    16,172
    Likes Received:
    31,056
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    #fragile
     
    alam1108 likes this.
  19. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    36,599
    Likes Received:
    60,835
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    So Cal
    Offline
    Well he's got your jeans. :p :giggle:
     
  20. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    28,353
    Likes Received:
    76,284
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Online

Share This Page