Two of my favorite posters backing up their arguments with well reasoned thought even though they don’t agree. But if your posting history and evaluation of talent is any indication, you guys are probably both wrong . #trustingLukeinstead
Says the dude that provided this bit of player evalzuation: Bro, the only center you should be concerned about is AD. Zo with the 2nd unit gives him run with Kuz and Hart. Trade BI/our entire 2018 draft class/future picks for AD into our cap space next summer and then our starting unit becomes: Zo, Hart, Kuz, Bron, AD You really about that white boy love and that's racist tbh. #CantTrustaHatah
It doesn't matter what kind of game we try to bring to the table when Real puts his mind to it. He's going to win no matter if its legit or not. Haha
AD is pipe, and he has a couple more years left on his contract. There is no motivation to trade him at all. If he manages to force his way out, I would be completely shocked. Pass me some of what you are smoking LOL
Is "passed me some of .... " like the new way it seems acceptable to use "lost" as a noun now? :Joshharthearthands:
The way he's talking about how Zo is elite already and how much he knows about the Ball family's inner workings, I'm getting ready for Real to RaVeaL something about himself... And if that's the case, dude doesn't lose...he's undefeated... nevah lost. Btw, Luke thinks Rondo is elite...so either way, we'll have an elite guard playing off the bench and on the court at all times. @sirronstuff you been smoking if you can't get hype for AD. With 2 years on his contract and the inevitable super max offer on the cusp, why replace his representation now? You better start following dem crumbs... #PiedPiper
I blame Siri I’m totally surfing and driving, and using Siri to make posts and I don’t always double check grammar
Like I said: if you want to build an argument against Lonzo starting, you went after his talent. It's the wrong move. You made a bad call trying to sit him for Rondo when it's pretty clear he's a better fit for LeBron and a more talented player. Now if you want revise your reasoning and say it's because he needs time to heal instead of time to "earn it", that's a far more palatable reason. It's reaching because it's a strawman argument. You're setting yourself up so your argument looks better by trying to equate starting Lonzo after two games to the Lakers winning a championship. Those two things are completely different, completely separate, and not connected within the context of this argument (although starting Lonzo probably does increase our odds of winning a championship minutely). The two game sample size showed that Lonzo is a) prepared to start and finish games and b) a more talented and (more importantly) a more well-rounded player than Rondo. The two game sample size in the pre-season where our 3rd stringers end up pulling away from the Warriors' 3rd stringers is not a good indication that we're going to beat them in the Western Conference Playoffs, although it does show a certain competitiveness that I enjoy and might indicate our depth is better. It's less reaching than what you're doing to try to justify making Lonzo "earn it" when he already is. When a kid brings home an "A" do you tell them they have to "earn it" still? Lonzo passed the test with flying colors. The offense looks better with him. The defense looks better with him. The flow is better. The speed is better. The passing is better. If we want to both reach: the shooting is better. Eeeeeesh. Again man, just not the best argument to take. Is Rookie of the Year the metric with which we judge young talent? I mean heaven forbid he doesn't end up in the same vaunted heights of Malcolm Brogdon, Andrew Wiggins, Tyreke Evans, and Emeka Okafor. We both know he didn't get the votes due to injury and narrative. Not to mention the red-shirt freshman getting votes and what is going to go down as a historic draft class. #narrative Got to #dobetter. I said among starting guards. The first name on that list is Shane Larkin. The second is Jabari Bird. Those are not starting guards and they have a 2 game window. C'mon now. You know better. We've been over the statistics a dozen times over the last few months. And how are you going to say you can't judge Lonzo based on two pre-season games, but then try to use his pre-season stats against him? The better argument: he's not listed on basketball-reference.com's leaderboard. The reason: missed games means he doesn't hit their requirements for the leaderboard. You have to spend a couple seconds and really look at his numbers compared to the elite players in the NBA. He's there in most defensive categories, especially among guards. If it wasn't for Ben Simmons, people would be utterly amazed by what Lonzo did statistically last year. It's a lazy narrative and easy to attack when people go after the kid's talent. His talent is undeniable. If you want to make this argument for keeping him out of the starting lineup, I can at least get behind it even if I don't agree. But to question the kid's talent level or that he's got more talent than Rondo is just incorrect. I disagree that he shouldn't start. He can start and finish games and still be on a limited minute count to ensure he's not putting himself at risk. But knowing the injury, he should be fine. The chance of re-injury on that knee after the procedure given this much time off doesn't increase or decrease much with limited minutes. The only thing that needs to come back is his conditioning.
Alright a few things right off the bat... You checked the filters I added to the stats link I provided? They are filtered for starting guards who played 20+ mins per. You can add another filter that has at least 41 games played and still Zo isn't top 10. But with Zo playing as an elite defender (and I think he will be special in that regard), his defensive ranking is at just under 105 while Rondo's is just under 106. We know Rondo's D has dropped off some quite a bit, but he cranks it up in the postseason....so all things considered, Zo is playing good defense, but Rondo is still (at 11 yrs Zo's senior) comparable. When it comes to knee surgery of pretty much any kind, blunt force trauma and overuse impact reinjury. You rush Zo back and it will absolutely impact his knee rehab. So monitoring his minutes is not only a must, it's the right thing to do if we look at him as one of our foundational pieces. And to the rest of what you said, I'll be working on a response...
Maybe it was my computer, but your link didn't have the parameters. Here's where I'm getting mine: guards who started 50 games he's tied for 10th in Drtg. http://bkref.com/tiny/Vdzc9 Again, the greatest threat to re-injury for Lonzo is... playing basketball. The only thing he needs to do is be fully conditioned. That however wasn't your reasoning before for sitting him. What you kept saying was that he needed to earn it over Rondo. The kid already has done that and he's already showing he's a better fit for the way the ball doesn't stick in his hand and his ability to switch defensively.
