Brandon Ingram Discussion: He Is Who We Thought He Could Be

Discussion in 'NBA Discussion' started by Lakers2015, Jun 23, 2016.

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  1. SilkWilkes52

    SilkWilkes52 - Rookie -

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    Right. KD is a good example although I don't think that he could hold up playing defense in the post for extended stretches without altering his game. When Magic told BI to go to the hole more last year, BI showed he had the strenghth to get to the paint but got beat up in the process. Yep, he might be skinny but there are plenty of examples of BI matching up well physically to know he's strong ... he'll continue to grow with conditioning and added strength.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 27, 2018
    SilkWilkes52, Jul 27, 2018
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  2. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    Well that's Durant now. He was still pretty darn skinny as a sophomore (although he wore clothes so baggy it was hard to find him in his jersey).

    Rookie Durant:
    [​IMG]

    Sophomore Durant:
    [​IMG]

    Old Vet Durant:
    [​IMG]

    Ingram rookie year:
    [​IMG]

    Sophomore Ingram:
    [​IMG]

    Third season is still building. The only really important areas of big muscular development for players like that where you want them to pack on weight is in their legs and butt. They need to add size to deal with the stamina of running forever on such slender limbs. Their upper bodies need to be strong, but not necessarily big. Even now Durant isn't a "big" guy, just bigger than he used to be. As long as Brandon has strong legs and a strong core, those are my two main concerns. Upper body strength will help him absorb contact and finish around the rim which is also important, but he's shown a pretty decent aptitude for that already.

    I spoiled the pictures just for sizing purposes.

    A great example for the types of body these guys need is one of Brandon's idols: Iceman Gervin.

    [​IMG]

    A thin guy, but with very strong legs and good core strength.
     
    therealdeal, Jul 27, 2018
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  3. bfc1125roy

    bfc1125roy - Rookie -

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    Yeah, wasn't trying to say BI needs to be capable of that next season, just showing what is possible. We all know how badly Artest's physicality bothered Durant until 2012 (4 seasons into the league).

    For reference to your pictures:
    He was 212 in 07, 223 in 09, 231 in 11, and 237 in 13. Now is around 242-ish, possibly more.

    He only doesn't look big because 1) His limbs are long so the increased muscle cross sectional area is spread over a longer range, and 2) His frame and muscular inserts (genetic) are in such a way that they don't appear "big" right off the bat (won't get into detail on this.. but you can look up how different bicep insertions, for example, can drastically change the appearance of arm size). He is still very strong and has significantly increased his muscular hypertrophy.

    Disagree about the upper body. Obviously, BI shouldn't skip leg day, and the muscle groups in your lower body have the most potential for growth compared to the smaller muscles in your chest, arms, and shoulders... but in order to finish through contact and sustain slashing over an 82 game season, he needs more mass in the upper body as well. And again, the biggest predictor of strength is muscle size, so if he wants strength there he'll have to get bigger there also.

    It's a long term process. I don't think anyone wants him coming into camp at 250 next year, or the year after that, or after that.
     
    bfc1125roy, Jul 27, 2018
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  4. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    How old was Gervin here?

    [​IMG]

    Brandon seems to be doing just fine. Plus he is bigger this summer in the current Instagram pics than his sophomore year below.

    [​IMG]



    Of course Gervin himself would have to get bigger than that above for today's NBA.
     
    LTLakerFan, Jul 27, 2018
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  5. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    You're disagreeing with something that we agreed on, so I'm not sure you're reading what I'm writing. :D

    He needs some size, sure, but it's not as vital as size built around his legs and butt. Those areas are far more important to build mass on. Strength comes in many ways and is unique to every person. Yes, size is a typical indicator of strength, but we are discussing players who are atypical. They will not really build much size, especially in their upper bodies. I was a personal trainer and my wife is a therapist, I'm aware of muscle variation and the different benefits/problems of growth. Nobody is saying he should only focus on one thing instead of many things, but his primary focus should be on balance, core strength, and lower body strength. If you read what I posted I am the one who said his upper body needs to be strong to finish through contact. :D

    It's not about potential growth either, it's about strength and wear and tear. For thinner people like BI and Durant and Iceman, having a strong core and bigger legs helps deal with the wear and tear better. Putting muscle mass in their upper body when they're that thin just puts more pressure on the joints for thin people. Look at where Durant put the most size/muscle on in ^ those pictures. It's his legs. Also using your example, holding his own in the post against Durant is going to be using a ton of that lower body and core strength to hold a bigger object at bay.

    Ingram will need to work on his upper body as well, but it looks like he's doing that to the extent he needs to. Ingram came in actually lighter than Durant by about 15-20 pounds if I remember correctly. I'd love to see Ingram come in to camp at around 215 or 220 or so.

    Here's a GQ article that talks about Ingram and his diet for what it's worth. https://www.gq.com/story/real-life-diet-brandon-ingram
     
    therealdeal, Jul 27, 2018
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  6. bfc1125roy

    bfc1125roy - Rookie -

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    My bad I misunderstood. Yeah, I share your views on this.

    He'll never be 240. I don't think he'll come into camp at 220, given he's 190 now. But I would like 200, and get to 220 in a few years. I think he'll top off around there.
     
    bfc1125roy, Jul 27, 2018
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  7. Jaguar

    Jaguar - Lakers 6th Man -

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    George Gervin...

    [​IMG]

    My favorite basketball player...
     
    Jaguar, Jul 27, 2018
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  8. SilkWilkes52

    SilkWilkes52 - Rookie -

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    Oh ... Thats sweet pic of the Iceman. Believe Brandon said thats who he modeled his game on when he was young.
     
    SilkWilkes52, Jul 27, 2018
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  9. gcclaker

    gcclaker Moderator Staff Member

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    The real Ice, Ice, Baby! No one was more slicker...

    [​IMG]
     
    gcclaker, Jul 27, 2018
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  10. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    I thought he came in at 190 and had put on muscle since then, but I cant find any proof of that so nevermind! I'd hope for 205 then. That's not impossible.
     
    therealdeal, Jul 27, 2018
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  11. sirronstuff

    sirronstuff - Lakers Legend -

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    then there is old man stremph

    :Byronfistfight:

    ..... Temecula!
     
    sirronstuff, Jul 27, 2018
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  12. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    Here 2 different sites' stats. 196 in the first and 190 in the 2nd. So you would appear to be right.

    http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Brandon-Ingram-7260/

    Although the site ^^^ above is calling him 21 for some reason.

    https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/...mons-and-brandon-ingram-compare-head-to-head/
     
    LTLakerFan, Jul 27, 2018
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  13. bfc1125roy

    bfc1125roy - Rookie -

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    Well that's draft stats. He weighed in at 190 at the start of this season. But who knows what he actually weighs. These things are misreported all the time just like player height. After all, coming out of HS he was apparently 191?

    Anyways enough with the guy's weight. He'll gain what's necessary I don't doubt that. It will just take some time.
     
    bfc1125roy, Jul 27, 2018
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  14. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    Yeah I was just replying to realdeal. Doesn't seem to be one set figure coming out of college but seems to be at least 190.
     
    LTLakerFan, Jul 27, 2018
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  15. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    my uneducated opinion is that if you're strong enough to a) stay on the floor, and b) finish with contact, then you're strong enough, period.

    i think ingram has shown progress on b), but not a).

    lonzo has shown neither, but i'm hopeful.
     
    abeer3, Jul 27, 2018
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  16. LakerFanIam

    LakerFanIam - Lakers 6th Man -

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    Ingram is gonna be a straight up Killer this Season.. Book it.
     
    LakerFanIam, Jul 27, 2018
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  17. Toklat

    Toklat - Lakers Starter -

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    Leverage, determination and a little nastiness go along way. The strength will come if players work.
     
    Toklat, Jul 28, 2018
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  18. SilkWilkes52

    SilkWilkes52 - Rookie -

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    Thats a good take.
     
    SilkWilkes52, Jul 28, 2018
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  19. SilkWilkes52

    SilkWilkes52 - Rookie -

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    BI's length helps him a lot on finishes. Don't know for sure, but I thought a lot of their injuries occured when they were fatigued
     
    SilkWilkes52, Jul 28, 2018
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  20. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    [​IMG]
     
    TIME, Jul 28, 2018
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