Brandon Ingram Discussion: He Is Who We Thought He Could Be

Discussion in 'NBA Discussion' started by Lakers2015, Jun 23, 2016.

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  1. SmoothOperator

    SmoothOperator - Lakers 6th Man -

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    The reason why I say LeBron would stunt Ingram’s growth is because... can we really name a player that LeBron actually made better?

    The only player I can conceivably see a argument for is Kyrie. But besides that, I see a lot of Lebrons past teammates plateaued but haven’t really grown.
    - Kevin love/Chris bosh never actually grew as players. They just were demoted to spot up shooters and scapegoats.
    - Wade was wade, never really took his game to another level
    - a lot of the role players never actually got better playing with him (Shumpert, Tristan, JR Smith, Chalmers, etc)

    Ironically, during Kobe’s playing days the narrative was that he was selfish and didn’t make his teammates better while LeBron was the opposite. But the argument can be made Kobe made Bynum, Odom, Gasol, Ariza, Shannon Brown better players
     
    SmoothOperator, Feb 25, 2018
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  2. revgen

    revgen - Lakers 6th Man -

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    I'm not so sure about Odom. He was a pretty good player before he came here, especially in Miami. I do agree about the other players.

    Whether Lebron stunts BI or the other players depends upon whether he buys into Luke's philosophy or not. He's not 25 years old anymore. It would do him good to fit into a system that favors ball movement and man movement as opposed to depending on him to do everything. It's working well for KD in Golden State.
     
    revgen, Feb 25, 2018
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  3. tada

    tada - Lakers All Star -

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    Oh Kobe definitely instilled the mamba mentality into Gasol and Odom. They instantly became tougher players. They became winners. Same goes for his teammates on the USA team. Everyone admires Kobe's mental approach and always seeks for his tutelage.

    Lebron never had that killer instinct. That's why he needed Wade and Kyrie to win... both disciples of Kobe btw lol
     
    tada, Feb 25, 2018
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  4. Khmrp

    Khmrp - Lakers Legend -

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    solid one on one d, gota get better at not getting completedly enveloped when he runs into screens
     
    Khmrp, Feb 25, 2018
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  5. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    At least now it's not the definition of insanity .... forsaking any jump shots and just getting the s*** kicked out of him going to the rack on every possession almost at the start of this season. He was doing better than last year and scoring well even but damn .... not good on that slender body. Guy's fearless in his head. Gotta love it.
     
    LTLakerFan, Feb 25, 2018
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  6. OX1947

    OX1947 - Lakers MVP -

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    LeBron never made any player better. Ever. I say that in all seriousness.
     
    OX1947, Feb 25, 2018
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  7. sirronstuff

    sirronstuff - Lakers Legend -

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    Lebron is a cancer tbh
     
    sirronstuff, Feb 25, 2018
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  8. sirronstuff

    sirronstuff - Lakers Legend -

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    sirronstuff, Feb 26, 2018
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  9. alam1108

    alam1108 - Lakers Legend -

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    alam1108, Feb 26, 2018
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  10. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    This is interesting. It comes mostly from the fact that Ingram looks like he's going to be a solid shooter and Simmons... does not. Simmons does a lot of things well, but he does not shoot the ball. He is 0 for 10 for the whole season from outside. In 1985 minutes, Ben Simmons has taken only ten threes and made none of them. In fact on the entire season Ben Simmons has taken just 34 shots from 16 feet or further out. He's made 10 of them (29%). From 10 feet out to the three point line Ben Simmons is shooting 30.5% (51/167). That's astounding.

    What's even crazier, is how good Simmons is in today's NBA, without being able to shoot.

    Simmons numbers: 16.7 points, 7.7 rebounds, 7.4 assists, 1.8 steals, 0.9 blocks 53.3 FG% 0 3PT% 56.9 FT%
    Ingram numbers: 16.1 points, 5.3 rebounds, 3.8 assists, 0.8 steals, 0.7 blocks 46.4 FG% 38.5 3PT% 68.8 FT%

    Simmons Advanced numbers: 107 Ortg 103 Drtg 23.2 USG% 54.8 TS%
    Ingram Advanced numbers: 103 Ortg 110 Drtg 21.9 USG% 53.1 TS%

    Now if you want to cherrypick a bit, we can focus on Ingram's best stretch here in the month of February to Simmons in February:

    Simmons February (10 games): 16.5 points, 7.4 rebounds, 7.9 assists, 2.2 steals, 0.9 blocks 55.7 FG% --3PT% 60.4 FT% 57.6 TS% 120 Ortg 102 Drtg
    Ingram February (9 games): 18.3 points, 4.7 rebounds, 5.6 assists, 0.6 steals, 0.9 blocks 53.4 FG% 54.5 3PT% 79.4 FT% 62 TS% 120 Ortg 112 Drtg

    Can Ingram be better? I don't know, maybe, but Simmons has been preposterous.
     
    therealdeal, Feb 26, 2018
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  11. vasashi17

    vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

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    Yeah, but is he averaging 20 points tho?

    :Magic Brows:

    Its soooo unfair to place those type of expectations on him...Dude is too brittle to meet that type of goal. Magic broke him!

     
    vasashi17, Feb 26, 2018
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  12. Weezy

    Weezy Moderator Staff Member

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    This is an interesting question at least. I’m not sure Ingram will be better, but as he continues to grow into his NBA body, if his progression continues at a nice pace, and Simmons doesn’t add a shot to his game, it’s possible. He plays similar to LeBron, but LeBron had to add a better jumper in time as well, I think the lack of one eventually catches up to you. Also worth noting, Simmons is a little over a year older than Ingram (Ingram September ‘97, Simmons July ‘96), so he’s got not only the NBA ready body on him already, but also a year more experience.
     
    Weezy, Feb 26, 2018
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  13. Battle Tested20

    Battle Tested20 Moderator Staff Member

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    wow that's impressive. I knew he was playing great lately, but not that great with the only other player with that similar stat line being LBJ.
     
    Battle Tested20, Feb 26, 2018
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  14. tada

    tada - Lakers All Star -

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    Lonzo is our version of Simmons and a better comparison imo. Simmons is bigger but Lonzo can shoot. Both have the potential to be transcendent with their playmaking similar to Lebron.

    Ingram is a different kind of player. He's a versatile 3&D wing in the mold of George, Kawhi, Durant.
     
    tada, Feb 26, 2018
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  15. sirronstuff

    sirronstuff - Lakers Legend -

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    This is cool, but I am kind of surprised at 10 drives per game
     
    sirronstuff, Feb 26, 2018
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  16. JLaker17

    JLaker17 - Lakers Starter -

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    JLaker17, Feb 26, 2018
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  17. alam1108

    alam1108 - Lakers Legend -

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    Yeah lets not trade him. For any reason.
     
    alam1108, Feb 26, 2018
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  18. Weezy

    Weezy Moderator Staff Member

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    That length, my goodness. He took over the 3rd when they made a run, pretty much closed it out there. He even seemed to play a little angry, getting beaten up with no calls, took it to the rim over and over and made them give him a call.
     
    Weezy, Feb 26, 2018
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  19. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    That was... enlightening. That 3rd quarter was dominant. He's playing at a different level right now.
     
    therealdeal, Feb 26, 2018
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  20. ElginTheGreat

    ElginTheGreat - Lakers MVP -

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    ElginTheGreat, Feb 26, 2018
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