Russell Westbrick Discussion: Clipper Gonna Clip

That's the guy who got him this last deal. super max 206.5 mil. The thing with Russ is we absolutely know why he fired this guy. His agent served him up a slice of reality pie and told him "Look, we fooled them last time and got you the big paper, hallelujah, but it ain't gonna happen again, redefine yourself, play defense, be a team player, lay off the stats" and Russ said "fooled them....whoa.... hold on a minute....have you seen my stats m***** f*****? Don't you know who I am? Teams will kill for me. My numbers prove my value" This new agent has got some 'splainin' to do' next summer when the offers start not happening. Russ' best bet is some small market team that is really down on its luck and needs a center of attention and entertainment, like Oklahoma, Spurs or Orlando will throw some cash his way to keep some fans in the stands while they play the lotto.

 

Westbrook new introduction song at staples.

 

They were 11-11 with Westbrook last year. That's 1/4 of the season. Westbrook is a trash player in the wrong era with an entitled attitude. He is the perfect recipe for losing. When you get this through your brain, then you will understand basketball instead of Fantasy Land.

 

When you get it through your brain that 21 games, Davis lasted about 5 minutes in 22, spread out of an 82 games season doesn't mean anything, Then you will begin to understand that actual Basketball isn't like the video game. The C Bags were 23-24 in January and 10th place in East.

 

Russell Wesrbrook hasn't won s***, won't win s*** and never will win s***. When you understand this, one day you will understand. If you don't, then you will continue to lose this argument.

 

i don't really understand the analogy here. you're arguing that russ needed to play with both lebron and AD for more than a quarter of a season to know what we had (i disagree, i'd seen enough). but the C Bags core had played together for years as they were disappointing in the first half of last season. they made a nice trade and found a groove, but it's not like they needed time to gel. their heavy rotation guys were pretty much the same dudes before and after.

 

The point was that Tatum, Brown, Smart and Horford were playing. That was their core 4. Sometimes it takes a team time to gel.

If you bring in Russ to play with AD and Lebron, the team has to gel around that core, that is impossible if they played 21 games together period. How in the hell can you " gel" if the 3 only played in 5 straight games all season? This Westbrook "fit" stuff is ridiculous, we never got to see if it worked or not, AD pointed this out directly, when he said that the three of them never played together enough to be able to work anything out. The owner said that she'd like to actually see them play together before determining whether it would work too. Somehow...this doesn't make any sense around here. That’s just some BS Westbrook hate IMO.
The C Bags are the perfect example, you had guys that played together for years and they still took time to gel last season. However NO...21 games total is enough around here!! Nonsense.

 

i think the issue was that russ was a bad fit on paper, and then basically nothing happened in 20 games to support a contrary notion. does it mean nothing could? no. but it's certainly not confidence-building.

the C Bags group had had years of success together already, so there was reason to believe they could play well together.

 

Meh..for some reason you seem to think that Westbrook is more important than Lebron or AD. That's crazy..AD had never won s*** before joining Lebron. Frankly neither has won s*** here without playing with the other.

 

They have to PLAY bro..paper doesn't mean anything, the guys have to find their way on the court. It would have been at least a bit more plausible argument, if they had played 21 games straight. We jump around trying to decipher something based off of James and Davis playing a few scattered games,when one or the other were returning from injury. With a totally new roster and the envisioned 4th guy never suiting up! Anywhere else, that's absurd, but with the Lakers, it makes perfect sense. SMH

 

does having james/ad with russ all season lead to less TO and better fg% for Russ?

 

What is an adequate barometer of fit? 20 games straight? 25/30, 30/40, 40/50??

 

The fit was AD, Lebron and Russ. Obviously Lebron doesn't fit with any true facilitator at PG,because he is a high level true facilitator himself.

Davis is the anchor to that working out. When AD is on the floor the offense doesn't revolve around LeBron. He's plays off of Anthony. When AD is out, our offense goes back to orbiting around James, when that happens pass first guards don't work with him. He didn't play well with Rondo, Lonzo, Schroeder or Russ. The only exception is Rondo in the bubble when he lost his mind and was knocking down shots all over the place like Kyrie and Wade. Westbrook can't morph into a DWade or Kyrie, he's not a shooter. He worked fine with James Harden, because Harden just shifted more into the 2 guard role. Bron is about to be 38, we have to stop thinking in terms of what works best for him. Ham has alluded to this on several occasions too. Folks only pay attention to his comments about Westbrook. James needs to make an adjustment too. It's easier to see it happening through AD as the focus, something else Ham has been saying repeatedly.

 

It's like any team, you expect your core to play together all season and make adjustments along the way. In order to gauge how things fit, they need to play at the least a half a season. Not only does the 3 of these guys ,need to to figure what is their best configuration on the court. We have a whole team that has never played with them either. Their roles have to be sorted out to. Reaves, and Gabriel are the only guys coming back that's at least played some with these three guys. It"s going to take some time. That doesn't mean that we can't win a lot of games during this process either. Our early schedule is soft, like it always is.

 

Why shouldn't it? He will get better looks with them on the court. His FG improved last season from Washington and his turnover were down too, his turnovers were at the lowest rate in 8 seasons.

 

The single biggest issue we've had with this team, was that LeBron and AD have played 27 and 21 games together over the last two seasons. Everyone seems to be obsessed with ignoring that fact, as if anything else, but that is the real problem.

 

Ok, so 40ish games, playing pretty consistently together…
Are there any instances you can recall (on any team, ever) where it’s clear that the fit won’t work before the requisite 40ish games?

Btw, I’m not trying to be a lawyer and trap you to counter your argument. I’m genuinely interested in your epistemology in arriving to your opinion. I’m curious if you think there are exceptions. If so, why don’t they apply to Russ and the lakers.

 

i think the weird thing is that you had to move the goal posts to the "played together" metric because so many other teams have weathered similar injury absences (including our own, pre-russ).

lebron and AD have played together enough, and as punk is intimating, 20-game samples are usually good enough to get a sense of how things might work.

but then you move the goal posts to "20 games in a row" or somesuch. you must forgive everyone for tiring of it. starts to feel like the chapelle skit on what it takes to convict r kelly.

 

Moving goal post? When have we weathered James and Davis playing in 30 games are less? They have only played together for 3 seasons. The one difference is that they played around 20 games straight in 21. We had a solid record before AD went down. We never recovered that season, and never got at least 20 or even 10 straight last season.


We are going to win if they play 20 or more straight. That's not the limit on how good the team can be, as currently constructed.

It's pretty simple and straightforward, we will be good if they are healthy, we could be great constructed as is.