The Rambii need to go if they're behind all of this. Vogel should not be fired. I wonder if the Westbrook trade was also pushed on Rob by the Rambii.
I’m the biggest fan for life of the Showtime Lakers: Kareem / Magic / Worthy / Scott / Rambis But that group does not have much of a confidence building NBA resume since retirement. Worthy was smart to settle in to his pre-game / post-game gig and stay out of the way
Yea I hope so too. I'm not even Team Vogel, but it's become apparent that the FO is attempting to skirt their share of the responsibility for the mess we are currently in.
Not the way he rolls IMO. That would be how he chose his words in his and his staff’s defense in the pre-game interview before we played Utah. My guess would be Handy maybe, sticking up for Frank and the staff knowing what they’ve been up against and besides they’re lucky to have him … f*** it he can always pick a great place to land if he leaves here or were to be let go.
I don't think Frank has been perfect -going to small ball center while playing midget guards -AND also refusing to switch everything and sticking with a traditional defense focused on funneling players into the paint (only now you don't have a center and you have a 37 yo guy who is also the linchpin on your offense trying to play like a traditional center) is and was dumb. But what we've seen from him is that he makes sure his players know what he is doing and they also know things aren't working out so when Frank decides to do something like bench Javale McGee pretty much for the playoffs, the team has bought in and even the demoted players understand their roles.
There is definitely legit criticism to be fielded towards ownership, the Rambii, etc … But the timing and contents of these stories is definitely starting to feel a little fishy… SOMEONE is trying to play us. I do almost hope it was Vogel. I hope that his job is not seriously in jeopardy, so this was just some pre-emptive play to get himself some more protection (knowing that this story would likely result in public backlash towards the front office). But I agree that I don’t think Vogel has that in him.
I could see Phil doing something like that. Vogel doesn't seem as scheming or Machiavellian as the Zen master (Phil, not the poster here lol)
The more I mull on this the more irritated I get. So here are my scattered thoughts on the matter... 1) Vogel got A LOT of hate from all of us for sticking with DJ and the big lineup too long. It was actually Fiz who broke from that lineup. Based on the Rambis report, maybe sticking with DJ wasn't in his hands and came from upstairs. Maybe he let Fiz try the small lineup because if it didn't work, they're not firing Fiz over it. But if Vogel failed with it, it would be the nail they need to close his coffin. 2) Even if Bron likes Lue more than Vogel, which he clearly does with his earlier comments this year where he had to nearly stop himself from calling Lue the greatest coach in the history of the NBA. Even then, I wouldn't think he would want Vogel fired like this. It only fuels the coach killer narrative, which he cares about. Few in the NBA care more about image and perception than LBJ. It would be much less messier to let him finish out the season. Bron also has to know with his extensive coach scouting that I'm sure he will claim he's doing that there ain't s*** out there right now and this upheaval will essentially throw away one of his final 2 or 3 years left in the league 3) The non-extension extension is such a bull s*** move from Rob. Look at the Coach Bud situation that transpired in Milwaukee. He was a coach who's job was on the line. If they didn't win the championship, he was out the door. They won and they give him an earned and deserving 3 year extension. That's how you reward winning. Frank got us ours not even 18 months ago and is now being examined on a game to game basis. If the goal, expectation, and reward isn't championship based? Then what the f*** is it based off of? Last year without Bron and AD, we still had the best defense. This year with THIS ill-fitting roster and with covid and injuries, we're still squarely in the mix. I don't know if even Phil could get water out of this stone. 4) Kind of tied to that previous point - OPTICS. How does any of this make this an attractive gig to any head coach candidate? You can't pick your staff. You won't get a long term deal. There's zero job security. Winning doesn't mean s***. Your roster isn't great and might change as soon as you have any success with it. Rambis will give you notes. You have a shadow coach in Bron. And certain personnel that can only play very specific style of basketball. 5) Rambis: who the f*** are you? You've been a lousy coach everywhere. You're out of touch with today's game. Any thoughts he has to offer, our best bet is it do the exact opposite. You might be OK in a front office role... doubtful. But please for the love of all things holy, keep your coaching thoughts to yourself. And if you dare come down from your office and act as interim head coach, I'm out. 6) Taking another look at Frank's pregame comments before the Jazz game where he really went to bat for himself and the coaching staff as a whole, unusually so, now it makes sense. I think he very well thought that might've been his last pregame interview with the media as the Lakers head coach. I can't imagine that level of unfair stress and anxiety. He'll be bald or gray by the end of the year if it miraculously makes it through the year.
Vogel is getting fired if we don't at least get out of the West. This was pretty obvious to me, when they dragged their feet on the extension. Now of course, the way things have played out thus far, with the injuries and all that, creates some sympathy towards him. I don't think Frank ever had the full backing, of all the decision makers involved in the first place. The guy didn't even get to pick his own staff. Winning a title didn't exactly change some people in the FO, opinion of him apparently. If this Grammy road trip goes left, he won't make it to the playoffs or play in games. If you start seeing more Dwight or DJ...trust that he is definitely trying to save his job.
.... more Dwight makes sense. LeBron doesn't have the stamina for both offense and importantly defense and rebounding all those same minutes at the 5.
Agreed all the way JSM. I’ve been down on Vogel during his time here for some lineup issues but the bottom line is that he has demonstrated that he’s a good coach for this team and he won a championship to prove it. The fact that the FO is pulling this kind of shadiness and blaming him for their screwups is really bush league. As I’ve said before, we are the Lakers, I’m not used to this kind of crap coming down from the FO. Vogel wasn’t the one who got cheap on Caruso. Nor the one who put together such a lopsided roster when he is a defensive minded coach. We had to pick up Bradley and Johnson just to give him something to work with on that end. Honestly it almost looks like they have been setting him up to fail since the start of the season: they didn’t give him a real extension, they turned over all but three players on the roster and filled it in with offensive only guys, and they saddled him with Russ who is essentially uncoachable. They certainly didn’t do him any favors at the very least, but it almost smacks of sabotage. I would say that couldn’t happen here but after the timing of the FO saying Vogel is on a game to game basis it really makes you wonder. And it’s infuriating. This gives me no faith at all in our management.
Reading between the lines here. Kurt probably wanted him gone back when, Jeannie made those, we need to wait until we see what we actually have comments. She probably overuled the Vogel needs to go now crowd. She might be wavering now.
It's the NBA though, coaching changes usually occur when you bring in high end players. It's worth noting that Lebron and AD, haven't exactly been the most vocal Vogel supporters this season. I will continue to point to the fact that, we signed Dwight and DJ, then Frank promptly declared that AD was going to be the 5. Something seemed off to me right out the gate.
WUT?? Why?? That's exactly what coaches AD and LeBron worked out with Russ smoking cigars and drinking wine (probably) at James's crib.
LT the three of them were probably talking about who they wanted their next coach to be too. I haven't seen the " I'm going to bat for my coach" stuff from Lebron and AD at all this season. It's been rather low key or non commital IMO.
