Yeah, I mean it is what it is. How many more games do you think he would have won with this Lakers roster. Probably 2-3 more games? Idk. I don't care at this point. We just need to win games.
they also had one of the worse offense too, so yes less or non def players led to garbage D, whats the excuse for garbage O too?
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If we lose to Boston, I think it’s time. Would Vogel somewhat be the scapegoat for unideal roster construction? Sure. But it is what it is. As much as Vogel might not be THE problem, he’s also not doing much to demonstrate he’s a net positive for our team. To start the fourth quarter there were like 5 plays in a row where they attacked Lebron inside and mostly scored. They had a legitimate big man playing, that was not the time for Lebron at the 5. Yet he kept letting it happen. Then again at the end of the fourth, play after play of aggressive doubles to PG13 leading to the defense scrambling and leaving shooters wide open. Maybe that was poor defensive IQ on the players parts? I don’t know. But how do you not call a timeout and make an adjustment if you’re supposed to be a defensive coach? THT should NOT be playing along Russ and Lebron. That starting lineup is atrocious. Not a single shooter to space the floor. If you’re going to start big with AD and Dwight, it’s a no brainer to put Ellington in there. I also feel Vogel has been bad with challenges and timeout management. He’s been better with the challenges this year (ie, learning not to challenge just because your players are whining about a correct call), but I think he uses his timeouts too quickly and often leaves us in late game situations where we don’t have enough timeouts to advance the ball or draw up a play. Which reminds me … maybe the last point isn’t as big a deal considering how terrible/nonexistent he has been at drawing up end of game plays. Feels like it’s always just dump the ball to whichever of the big 3 wants it and let them settle for an iso 3. Fizdale might not be any better. He may actually be worse. But if we keep losing like this, we need to make a change, and we need to make it soon enough to build SOME continuity with the new coach. Often the very act of change is more important than the actual coaches being shuffled. Players lose their belief in the current coach, so once he’s fired the team rallies together around the new coach and actually start to buy in.
We will not be a better team without Vogel this year. We knew we would struggle at the beginning, there have been injuries, we will be better when it matters. Knowing LeBron, he will get him fired
He's the one who kept calling the hard double on PG even though the Clips brought in a shooter to counter. Actually think the Lakers didn't look bad at all: they looked liked a good team that was going to wear out an inferior opponent till the stupid Russ offensive foul and the Morris bank shot That being said when you're in a close game, Vogel continued insistence on playing starting lineup that frankly don't make sense is frustrating The dude finally start Dwight ahead of DAJ but he insists on having THT in there which is about the worst fit offensively you can get. Then calling the same defense after the offensive team makes an adjustment is on him.
i answered it, personnel isnt up to task for defense, so can you justify the bad offense last yr and this yr?
guess that explains why the clippers are so great, right? wait. what? oh. tyronn lue has adjusted them to a similar .500 record and a blowout home loss to the kings in their last outing? it's just lebron and AD pointing fingers again. which coach is a klutch klient? edit: the column in gray is team offensive rating: he must only adjust masterfully against us?
In Lebronland when finger pointing happens, usually coaches get fired and players get traded. In Lakerland when finger pointing happens, superstars get traded/leave. Its a perfect marriage for a reality show. This is a trainwreck and this is not going to end well. These guys were pathetic during the softest stretch of the year after a whole summer off, its only going to get worse when the days become even more challenging.
PG was out for the Sac game. Before us, they had lost 6 of 8, though. I guess the question would be just for a hypothetical: if Lue had Davis and Russ, could have have optimized them and this roster better as a whole? Who knows? It just seems that Davis, LBJ, and Monk went out of their way to complement him. Maybe it's just me.
he certainly couldn't have beaten us using the strategy he did, i can tell you that. i just think the lue hero worship is kinda funny. he's just like vogel--an average coach who was handed a very good, very expensive roster. lue's had the advantage that his team's constitution got to make sense (in large part because ownership didn't cheap out left and right). anyway, i wanted monty williams that year (check the receipts), but we won a title with vogel and lue's got nada. and the league's 25th ranked offense. oh and I’m pretty sure our guys are just trying to get Vogel fired because they’re embarrassed and don’t know what to do.
On our first year, the D Vogel implemented was based on defending the 3pt line and give space for the opponent to attack the basket where two 7 foot towers were waiting for them. It was a block party. What happened? This year we have the personnel, we just swapped McGee for Jordan. Our 3 center combined blocks: 2022: 2,2 + 0,7 + 0,9 = 3,8 2020: 2,3 + 1,1 + 1,4 = 4,8 We have 20% less blocks this year. Why is that? We can also see that AD is having the same numbers and we no longer have 3 players with at least one a game, that's huge. Let's see the minutes: 2022: 35,7 + 15 + 13,8 = 64,5 2020: 34,4 + 18,9 + 16,6 = 69,9 It's less 5 minutes per game. AD is the only with the same usage. The other Cs play less time which means more AD at the C. I think if we improve our defense in the paint, we play more in transition and spacing problems are less of an issue. And I would start to explore a play here and then setting up a Howard three
I think Lue is better than Vogel. That's just my opinion. When we were going through the hiring process, LFR called Lue a top 10 offensive coach. I wanted Monty, too. The concern with Monty was his questionable offense schematics. Turns out he has a pretty good offensive architect in Phoenix that is helping him. You know if we were going cheap out on the roster due to the luxury tax, I get it. What I don't understand is finding the best available coaching talent (assistants) and arming Frank with what he needs... That's a bigger indictment to me of their cheapness to me.
I don’t know. I feel like it’s a little more than that from the players but I guess there’s no way for us to really know. They definitely don’t seem to be going all in for Vogel which makes their comments stand out more. Then there’s the front office. Just seems like they were never really sold on Frank to begin with and still aren’t even with the title. No one is doing Vogel any favors right now which makes his situation that much tougher.
all of that is true. they seem to think of him as replacement-level, but i think he's better than that. years of data support me there, too. so you fire him, fine. it's not like you're losing a hof coach or something. but what happens? AD and lebron decide to try for a few games? was it worth it? do we actually think schemes and leadership from that position are the main problems here? i certainly don't. and i also don't buy that we'll get max effort from our stars if we simply replace the coach. and if we did, that would piss me off because they might have already squandered a shot at a ring by lollygagging for a third of the season.
