Russell Westbrick Discussion: Clipper Gonna Clip

Man Kawhi is a dirty dude. Im glad that flipper plan didn't pan out.

 

…. Welcome the hell home Russ and may the sun gods smile on you to have a great season.

And once again, thanks LBJ for absolutely no hyperbole …. saving the Lakers franchise.

Oh BOY the channeled hate toward the Clippers. Snake, Paula and that ugly, detestable little f***!

 

Kawhi Leonard is the Mark Zuckerberg of basketball, a socially awkward backstabber.

wow

 

Haven't been on the forums since the passing of Kobe - RIP to the Mamba.

But seeing the trade for Westbrook - who I always thought carried forward the mamba mentality - encouraged me to comment. I see quite a lot of division between posters on whether they like or dislike this trade. I'm optimistic on it for the following reasons:

• The trade makeup - We gave up Kuzma, KCP, Trez and the 22nd:
  • The 22nd isn't super important for a win now team - in return we got two 2nd rounders to help fill out some third string openings.
  • Trez wasn't going to come back regardless, so we managed to get trade value out of him.
  • Kuzma plateaued coming off the bench in LA.
  • KCP was a great fit, but not enough of an impact player to not trade.
  • Westbrook, much like AD, will out perform the package we traded for him.

• Floor raiser:
  • Westbrook is one of the best carries during the regular season alongside Harden and Lebron, allowing us to rest old man Lebron and injury prone AD more.
  • We'll win a lot of meaningless games because Westbrook brings it every night.
  • Whenever Lebron rests over the first 40 mins, Westbrook will take over with relatively no drop in quality when compared to the last few years. No one we traded can do that, and neither can Caruso.

• Fit:
  • Probably the most controversial point because Westbrook is just not a great shooter.
  • However, he has a lot of experience playing with other ball dominant players in KD, PG, Harden and Beal and all of them have played well next to him - arguably all having their best seasons.
  • The AD & Russ pick and roll/pop is going to be devastating. The big won't be able to close Westbrook down without letting AD role for an easy 2. If they big drops deep to allow Westbrook to shoot, he can attack the rim and force a double team while AD pops out for an easy shot. If the big marks AD tightly, Westbrook can attack the rim time and time again.
  • I agree the Lebron and Russ fit isn't the best, however Lebron has played with both Wade and Kyrie, so it's not the first time he has taken turns with another ball dominant player. Look to Harden and Russ for an example. When they traded Capela to open up space, Houston went on an incredible run behind those two attacking the rim. The bubble came at a bad time for them as they looked a real contender. Russ tore his quad when ramping up his training for the bubble and was never the same. When he got healthy again for Washington, him and Beal meshed and performed really well on a team with no other solid players.

• Clutch:
  • There is a lot of comments about his choking and bad decision making in the clutch but the numbers don't quite match his reputation.

There is also a reputation that Westbrook is a perennial loser, I don't buy this at all.

OKC were snake bitten and extremely unlucky not to break through during his time there.

2010: Conference Finals loss to Dallas
2011: Finals loss to Miami
2012: Patrick Beverley takes out Westbrook in first round
2013: Conference Finals loss to SAS. (Missing Ibaka for half the conference finals)
2014: KD out with foot injury for season
2015: Conference finals loss to GSW after being 3-1 up. KD chokes and leaves in the offseason
2016: MVP year with no help
2017: WB-PG-Melo team that underperforms
2018: WB-PG team that underperforms
2019: Bubble year - Westbrook playing with a torn quad

Over a 10 year period where Russ has been on good teams, he has made the finals once and the conference finals 3x losing to the eventual champion each go. His team have had a major star injured four of the 10 years. He had no help during his MVP year and then underperformed with PG twice. I would argue that Paul George is a pseudo star anyway and has constantly underperformed relative to his overrated billing.

 

This is arguably the best point I've seen anyone make about Westbrook. It's absurd to think he can't "fit" alongside ball dominant players.

 

Welcome back svtzr hope you will continue popping in more often.

 

good to see svtzr back.

my only real issue with the westbrook trade is that it consolidated our assets to the point where we can't pivot if things go bad. same with letting caruso walk. if the rest of the roster is minimums (or even one more player making 20+ and then minimums), it's hard to find paths to improvement for the next couple of years. we were hurt some in the early lebron era for this reason, imo.

but i agree on fit. lebron played with wade, and i actually think westbrook is a better complement than he was, tbh. his ball dominance will be a plus when lebron sits.

and i'm glad you posted those numbers on the clutch. when harden and westbrook were together, westbrook was the one that would worry me late in the game. feel like he just manufactures better looks than other guys do. and his ferocity just makes things happen in general.

he's got warts, and i worry about getting him when he's 32 instead of 28, but he's the best we could have done with what we were offering (maybe paul, but i don't trust his health). i suppose i thought walker might be a better fit, but his recent injury history worries me quite a bit, too.

anyway, i think westbrook might pleasantly surprise his detractors a bit.

 

Good to see you still posting here abeer!

I feel it's pretty clear we are going all in for the next two years with no real thought to what happens after or plan B if things go wrong. And I'm ok with it... Lebron is going to be 38, Westbrook will be an old 34, and AD will still be injury prone at the end of the next two seasons. So lets roll the dice to get another ring. You love to see it - may we just be blessed with health.

I agree with you in that Westbrook is a better compliment to Lebron. Wade is considered by many the better player, but the overlap with Lebron meant he could only really utilise 75% of himself. I'm really eager to see Westbrook attacking the rim for us, the guy is a force of nature and will bend the defence. My biggest worry is him standing around in half court sets when the ball isn't in his hand. That's why the Rockets moved Capela to open up space for Westbrook and Harden to attack the rim. I think with AD at center, we can recreate this paradigm.

 

Watching guys cut when and to where they can receive the ball from a good passer never seems like rocket science to me. I know Russ isn’t one but damn man don’t just stand around with your ability to move and jump when you have passers like James and Gasol playing with you. Not rocket science for the coaching staff too. F****** hopefully. Not like playing with Harden.

 

honestly, even with gasol at center, the lane can get open, and you have two passers who can see over the d and deliver long pinpoint passes to divers.

our current projected starting lineup should actually allow the space.

 

I bet he averages a triple double

LeBron will focus on scoring to get Kareem and avgs 30

 

Shirley, you’re not talking about Pelinka. Someone else in the FO? That guy has C and D lined up after “B”.

 

Not to mention his energy is infectious. He will demand the best out of everyone on the floor and not be afraid to call guys out in the locker room for lack of effort. If you're here for a check it's not gonna work out for you on the court with Russ on the team. That's a Kobe quality and I think we need more of that. This evened out the loss of Morris in these terms.

We've added some decent shooting to surround him and Bron, this is gonna be exciting.

 

It didn't work when he was in Houston.

 

Didn't ring true for the Mamba either.

 

Or CP3. Some guys play better with a chip on their shoulder and it even gets in other guys heads on the opposing teams causing them to play worse. Patrick Beverly also comes to mind lol

He had the black hole running the show over there, same reason CP3 left. Harden worked with Brooklyn because it isn't his team, it's Durants even though Kyrie thinks he's the man

 

people really underrate how hard it is to play with harden. he just stands there with the ball for...so...long. i can't imagine it, tbh. and then knowing he's going to put in token effort on d at best, and you're going to get blamed for all losses (see recent comments here).

no way i'd play with harden unless i had no skills aside from catching and shooting on offense and hustling my a** off on defense. "that sounds great!'", you say as a fan, but as a player, it's demoralizing. pj tucker got a new lease on an nba career because his limited skills could flourish next to a harden. but more talented players find themselves limited and scapegoated.

 

All I know is this, with Russ on this team, there's a real good chance the biggest poster of the season is one of our guys. There will be some oops to AD, Bron, or Dwight that will make you wanna call yo momma.

 

Agreed! He and Bron getting others easy buckets in the paint is gonna be fun to watch. Brons comings to the point in his career where he can't carry the scoring load all by himself but he's becoming more and more savy as a playmaker as he ages and with more talent surrounding him it should get even easier to facilitate. Win or lose this season its gonna be so much fun to watch.