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Kawhi Leonard Discussion: “I’m A Snake Clipper Guy.”

Discussion in 'NBA Discussion' started by Helljumper, Jun 15, 2018.

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fabfourlakers - Lakers Starter -

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@sirronstuff can you stop derailing threads? It's gotten pretty annoying man...just sayin

Anyway, I believe we're in the driver's seat now....that Cavs beat writer is just trying to help us get LeBron or what?

Then again, we need LeBron to opt out so we should still be motivated to get a deal done...

Def curious on how it turns out but I think Ingram is likely gone...would be amazing if it was Ingram, Deng, 2 firsts for Kawhi.

fabfourlakers, Jun 28, 2018

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jordan-esque said: ↑

76ers only offering Saric and Covington picks for Kawhi Leonard

#NoLeverage
Click to expand...

jordan-esque, Jun 28, 2018

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@sirronstuff can you please continue doing what you do? Helps me remain sane around here, thank you

Can't we just get PG and the Queen and retain all the kids please?

SamsonMiodek, Jun 28, 2018

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IF the Sixers were smart, which they aren't, they would trade Fultz+Covington and call it a day. Why would they need 2 point guards anyways? Especially one that broke for no reason last season. (Seriously, how do you come back during the season and not play during playoffs?) :nickyoungconfusedmeme:

Kawhi would allow them to compete with Boston, but whatever. Screw Philly.

lakerfan2, Jun 28, 2018

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fabfourlakers said: ↑

@sirronstuff can you stop derailing threads? It's gotten pretty annoying man...just sayin

Anyway, I believe we're in the driver's seat now....that Cavs beat writer is just trying to help us get LeBron or what?

Then again, we need LeBron to opt out so we should still be motivated to get a deal done...

Def curious on how it turns out but I think Ingram is likely gone...would be amazing if it was Ingram, Deng, 2 firsts for Kawhi.
Click to expand...

OX1947, Jun 28, 2018

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OX1947 said: ↑

Click to expand...

Multiple Office Space references in one day, I’m all for it. F*****’ A.

Weezy, Jun 28, 2018

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I really hope Kawhi goes to Philly, this would definitely be the complete opposite of being in Los Angeles lol. I'm pretty sure kawhi's camp will let Philly kindly know not to trade for him because you'll lose your assets for nothing

OmarE, Jun 28, 2018

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vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

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Per the NY Time's Marc Stein:

The San Antonio Spurs are moving closer to cutting ties with their superstar forward Kawhi Leonard, according to two people familiar with the team’s thinking, though the timetable on a potential trade remains unclear.

Realizing that hopes of repairing its damaged relationship with Leonard are fading by the day, San Antonio is ready to move on from Leonard provided that a palatable trade offer materializes this off-season, according to the people, who were not authorized to discuss the matter publicly.
Click to expand...

But the Los Angeles Lakers and the Philadelphia 76ers have been pressing the Spurs to trade Leonard this week, as both teams believe that acquiring Leonard would put them in pole position to try to sign LeBron James away from the Cleveland Cavaliers when free agency starts Sunday at 12:01 a.m., Eastern time.

Other marquee free agents include the Houston All-Star guard Chris Paul, who is widely expected to stay with the Rockets after they came within one win of an N.B.A. finals berth, as well as the Oklahoma City Thunder star forward Paul George, who grew up in Southern California and is deciding between a move to his hometown Lakers and staying with the Thunder.

Kevin Durant, the reigning two-time N.B.A. finals most valuable player, will also become a free agent on Sunday, but Durant has this month said repeatedly that he intends to stay with the Golden State Warriors after winning back-to-back championships in his first two seasons in the Bay Area.

The Lakers’ pursuit of Leonard, a two-time N.B.A. defensive player of the year, could hinge on San Antonio’s willingness to trade him to its longtime Western Conference rivals, especially since the Spurs naturally fear that the acquisition of Leonard would lead to the Lakers adding James or George, or both.
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But Leonard’s reported desire to play out the final season of his contract and sign with the Lakers in July 2019 as a free agent could prevent teams such as Boston and Philadelphia from matching the Lakers’ best trade offer for Leonard. The Lakers could assemble a trade package featuring highly rated up-and-coming players such as Kyle Kuzma, Brandon Ingram and Josh Hart as well as multiple first-round picks.

The Lakers could likewise decide that it’s counterproductive to give up so much in a trade for Leonard if he is willing to sign with them in free agency in a year. That’s the painful conclusion the Knicks reached after they gave up so much to acquire the All-Star forward Carmelo Anthony in February 2011 and struggled thereafter to build a quality roster around him.

The Lakers, though, took the patient approach a year ago when the Indiana Pacers made George available via trade, figuring that they would be able to comfortably sign him this summer. The Thunder jumped in, however, with a trade for George, who has enjoyed his time alongside the All-Star guard Russell Westbrook and has given increased consideration in recent weeks to staying in Oklahoma City — perhaps on a two-year deal that would allow George to return to free agency as early as July 2019.
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Another factor affecting Leonard’s fate is his health. The lingering effects from a mysterious quadriceps injury limited the 2014 N.B.A. finals M.V.P. to nine games last season and could make teams like Boston — the club widely hailed as possessing the league’s most attractive collection of trade pieces — hesitant to make the Spurs an asset-rich offer.

San Antonio Coach Gregg Popovich recently met face-to-face with Leonard in San Diego in an attempted first step toward repairing the team’s fractured partnership with its best player. But the summit appears to have done little to dampen Leonard’s desire to move on, despite the fact that San Antonio is the only team in the league capable of offering him a five-year “supermax” extension between mid-July and mid-October worth an estimated $219 million.

The frosty state of the partnership was clear during San Antonio’s first-round playoff loss to Golden State, when Leonard, 26, continued his injury rehabilitation away from the team and attended none of the Spurs’ five postseason games. ESPN reported this month that Leonard felt “the franchise turned on him” during the season once he started receiving outside treatment for his quadriceps tendinopathy in New York.
Click to expand...

vasashi17, Jun 28, 2018

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OmarE said: ↑

I really hope Kawhi goes to Philly, this would definitely be the complete opposite of being in Los Angeles lol. I'm pretty sure kawhi's camp will let Philly kindly know not to trade for him because you'll lose your assets for nothing
Click to expand...

it would be better if Leonard told Phi AFTER the trade

Khmrp, Jun 28, 2018

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according to two people familiar with the team's thinking? Are they in the Matrix or something? Or just full of pure elephant dung?

OX1947, Jun 28, 2018

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therealdeal said: ↑

Click to expand...

.... and I am thinking something nastier and more graphic.

It really is disgusting when it gets this transparent.

LTLakerFan, Jun 28, 2018

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Good article from Darius Soriano

As reports of the Lakers engaging the Spurs in trade talks to acquire Kawhi Leonard broke on Wednesday, the discussion instantly became one of how those discussions would play out and, more specifically, who had the leverage in the talks.

When it comes right down to it, leverage is the crux of every deal that involves a superstar and the team, be it the incumbent or the new suitor, who maximizes that leverage the best will end up *winning the trade. (*This is a relative term. Most teams who trade away the best player lose the trade. But the goal is to always make the best deal possible when dealing the best player and the way you do that is to maximize your leverage.)

Do the Spurs have leverage right now? Yes. They understand the Lakers really want Leonard and Leonard is under contract. You want the player? Meet our price. This should be the Spurs line of thinking and by all accounts, it is.

However, that leverage is finite and requires a deft handling of a particular timeline and requires the Lakers to act in a certain way for that leverage to be maintained.

The Spurs understand that their relationship with Kawhi is likely irreparable. Whatever nice quotes they float to the media about wanting him long term are grasps at more leverage.

But they know he cannot come to camp with the relationship the way it is and I think they know the likelihood of the relationship being altered significantly in a positive direction is low. They also know he just sat out an entire season and cannot risk a repeat of that this season.

The closer they get to training camp, much less into the start of the season, their leverage decreases. And they surely know they CANNOT go into the February trade deadline with him on the roster. A deal at that point will be trash for them. The breaking point for when a trade needs to happen is likely around the same time Kyrie was traded last year.

The conclusion they will come to: they have to deal him. And, reportedly, that’s where they are now.

The Lakers have leverage in this market, but it’s restricted by three things: time + available cap space + the wildcard of another team’s offer.

Time: If they insist on trying to make a deal happen quickly, before free agency begins, their leverage lessens and their offers will need to reflect that. It’s why the idea of “monster offers” are even talked about in the press as a real possibility right now.

Cap Space: And once they spend into the 2019 cap to the point that they no longer have a max space open for Leonard to sign there, their leverage goes down too. The threat for Kawhi to sign there is strongest when the Lakers actually have the space to do it, without any assistance.

Yes, they could still dump salary next summer if they need to. Or there’s always a sign and trade option. But bringing those things into the equation weaken the Lakers position based on the uncertainty of who they’ll be dealing with, what they incumbent team will want to accomplish in a deal with the Lakers, and any other number of factors that can complicate a deal.

Another Team’s Offer: Adrian Wojnarowski tweeted Thursday morning that the Spurs are engaged with several teams in trade talks – including the C Bags. Boston is a boogieman in every trade scenario for a top talent because they have a trove of young players and future draft picks they can throw into any deal. They also have Kyrie Irving who, depending on who you ask, may not be long for the C Bags roster since he is a free agent next summer and the team showed out well in the playoffs without him.

Whether Danny Ainge, known for playing hardball in trades and not wanting to give up long term assets for short term reward, is truly willing to toss in, say, Jalen Brown or the future Kings or Grizzlies picks the team owns for (potentially) a single year of Leonard is unknown. But the Spurs would be wise to play to the C’s interest and try to use it as leverage against the Lakers to get them to up their offers – especially in this early window of negotiations when, as said above, their leverage is highest.

So, what is the answer?

It seems the Lakers are going to have to accept they are unlikely to get into a position where they hold the leverage in a Leonard trade. There are scenarios where they can have their cake and eat it too, but those are not likely at all.

I mean, if the team got a commitment from LeBron only and were then able to retain the requisite cap space to sign Kawhi outright into next summer into, say, August? That would probably be enough to swing the pendulum back in their direction. If that also involved Julius Randle accepting his qualifying offer this year (which further maintains future cap space while also having Bird Rights on Randle for contract purposes next year) that is even better. If they can then find a taker for Deng at some point this summer for only draft picks, they’ve done all the requisite work to have a boatload of cap space next year to entice Leonard.

Barring a scenario that plays out this way (or similarly), I don’t know how they pressure the Spurs into a favorable deal at all, and surely not on a timeline which lines up for what we know the Lakers really want: for Leonard to be the first domino which triggers the rest of their free agency pursuits.

The Spurs know this. And, while they can, they will utilize this leverage for all its worth. But, if things get too far along it can all crumble for them. They know this too. So, it looks like the Lakers and Spurs are in a race against the clock. If the Lakers blink first, they will almost surely end up paying for it – literally with a deal giving up more than they likely want to.

Like they always say, the most important power a buyer has in a negotiation is the ability to walk away. Will the Lakers use that power? If they do, they might just get the leverage they want. But that could also cost them the player they seek.

Thank goodness I’m not the GM. This is too much stress and I’m only writing about it.
Click to expand...

https://www.forumblueandgold.com/2018/06/28/lakers-trade-rumors-spurs-kawhi-leonard/

wcsoldier81, Jun 28, 2018

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Antonio F. Irwinho‏Compte certifié@AnthonyIrwinLA 2 hil y a 2 heures

So y’all can correct my math but this is kind of where I stand as of right now… LeBron wants to be a Laker & wants Kawhi there. He knows it benefits his Lakers team if they get Kawhi for less, so he’s leaking that his choice has nothing to do with this trade to keep price down.
Click to expand...

wcsoldier81, Jun 28, 2018

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Has to be for Faried, Plumlee or Chanlder...

Jules s&t, Nuggets pick, our future picks, Moe, Bonga, Zu, TB for Kawhi and one of their bad contracts (ie Pau)???

vasashi17, Jun 28, 2018

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vasashi17 said: ↑

Has to be for Faried, Plumlee or Chanlder...

Jules s&t, Nuggets pick, our future picks, Moe, Bonga, Zu, TB for Kawhi and one of their bad contracts (ie Pau)???
Click to expand...

Why would we take on bad money when we could sign Lebron and PG outright AND keep our farm? No thanks.

If we're looking to make an ancillary deal, it's to get rid of Deng and include our 2019 1st.

lakerfan2, Jun 28, 2018

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vasashi17 said: ↑

Has to be for Faried, Plumlee or Chanlder...

Jules s&t, Nuggets pick, our future picks, Moe, Bonga, Zu, TB for Kawhi and one of their bad contracts (ie Pau)???
Click to expand...

This would corroborate what Ramona and Woj said about the Lakers moving for a pick, but how much bad money can they take back?

This talk would all but kill George to LA talks as well. We simply won't have enough room.

therealdeal, Jun 28, 2018

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Or that the Lakers can still get a 3rd team all NBA player who his in his prime and is a two way player without giving up anything. Lebron and Paul George, if Kuzma, BI and Lonzo improve alot this year, can be very dangerous. If Tatum, Brown and the clowns in Beanbag town did what they did, how the hell can't these guys make a run?

OX1947, Jun 28, 2018

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vasashi17 said: ↑

Has to be for Faried, Plumlee or Chanlder...

Jules s&t, Nuggets pick, our future picks, Moe, Bonga, Zu, TB for Kawhi and one of their bad contracts (ie Pau)???
Click to expand...

I'm not liking the sound of this tbh.

alam1108, Jun 28, 2018

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OX1947 - Lakers MVP -

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Would you guys STOP believing every little report that is out there? hahahahhah. Lakers are NOT going to take on more salary so they can get another high #1 pick from the Nuggets. The Nuggets are gonna be good, that pick means d***.

OX1947, Jun 28, 2018

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therealdeal said: ↑

This would corroborate what Ramona and Woj said about the Lakers moving for a pick, but how much bad money can they take back?

This talk would all but kill George to LA talks as well. We simply won't have enough room.
Click to expand...

could we even afford james doing something like that?

Khmrp, Jun 28, 2018

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