2022-23 Team Developments: News / Trades / Free Agents / Rumors

i'm not super keen on selling low on THT. that's what a deal like this would feel like to me.

i don't like deals with indy that don't involve turner. i'm of the (minority) opinion that just adding a shooter won't do much for us at all. we had monk last year and were terrible. and monk was better than hield.

 

I doubt we get Turner without giving up both 1st rounders.

 

YOU DON'T HAVE A NO TRADE CLAUSE .... YOU ASKED FOR A TRADE

 

yeah, then i'm out. he's a FA next year. if we like him, we're set to have a ton of space.

lol @boston. and yes, kd asked to be moved, but you're not giving up jaylen brown for a guy who doesn't want to be there.

i didn't imply that. i stated that having guys that can shoot doesn't really work how everyone thinks. especially if those guys don't play defense. you can't just "add shooting". the game doesn't work that way. it's not baseball.

hield's never been a defender. he costs 22 million per for two more years and will cost us assets to get. i'm out on him unless he's coming with something else i like.

spending assets on just hield is lunacy.

 

This is a sh*tty off season. It is going to be very difficult for us to have an impact roster. Right now, we suck. I am not sure any of our potential choices is going to move the needle enough. Kyrie will not solve our defensive needs, a 100% AD might but what are those odds? Every player we look at, Hield, Turner, Kyrie; all have their drawbacks and we will have limitations with any of them. On top of it, I am hearing that Kawhi is looking really good and is expected back at 100%, still think Thompson will improve over last season as he was just rounding back into shape and they still won a ring with him. I am almost convinced Lebron will play his last year for us next year and we will go directly into rebuild mode. We will probably keep our coach but Pelinka will likely be gone. Jeannie will have to face the fact that she and the Rambi have not really moved the needle over her brother and that is going to eat at her. If Rob doesn't hit a home run soon, the sky is going to start falling.

 

I would rather have THT.

 

As much talk as there has been about how bad our defense was last year, our offense was even worse. And as currently constructed, it looks to be even worse going into this coming year. With the loss of Monk, Lebron is literally our only positive offensive player returning from last year according to RAPTOR. (AD hopefully gest back to being a plus offensive player)

Hield sucks on Defense (-1.1 Def Rtg), but he played on two teams thats rosters were littered with negative defenders. Ham might be able to hide him better. I'm not high on THT at all so I'd definitely include him in a trade if the plan is to keep Lebron and AD. I'd only consider holding on to him if we are rebuilding because he brings no value to the team as constructed.

 

I like this take on Hield. He would be absolutely great near LeBron. If you add AD is even crazier. He's the type of guy who doesn't miss open shots. With a good offense scheme, he's averaging 4 threes a game minimum. That's huge.
Now, I also think that we are not winning hit with him if Russ is still around. And that may just happen. So I wouldn't be giving picks nor Nunn. Find other way. We need the picks if things go south, it's quite possible. And Nunn if healthy, will be a major addition. He's underated because he hasn't played but I'm expecting to see him in training camp.

Then, I still don't believe we have a package for Turner. He fits so many teams that I don't think Indiana are shopping. He would be great in Dallas, Miami, Bucks, Warriors, Toronto. Just on the contenders. They all have better packages. Him being on an expiring and having his bird rights (I think @abeer3 is missing this point) is worth the gamble. If he fits and is healthy enough, which can very well happen, you sign him for long. If he's broken, you get the expiring and move on. He's worth the gamble for so many teams. Indiana doesn't want to pay Russ. He will never play with Halliburton running the team so you don't pay 40m for a guy who doesn't play. You need to be compensated for that.
That's why the Knicks or Nets are the ones who make sense for them to take Russ. I mean, Knicks having cap space is the meme of NBA. They love it, think they are getting home runs and end up overpaying Randle and alikes. We need to be patient, but it's our job to make the move on Indiana. I would pay 2 firsts to get Hield and Turner if Russ goes. THT could go too. I would try protections or to scoop a 2nd but final offer would be without. Don't think they bite

Russ
THT
2027 pick
2029 pick

Hield
Turner

That's a bit doomsday. You need to go to the WMC

We all knew LeBron would end someday. And that he would make a team his way and not have many assets for the future. But we are actually in a good position. We have I think a couple of first to spare with NOP and a big expiring same time Lebron's contract ends. That's perfect scenario, we can offer a max next year. Last year was disappointing but we still found Stan and Reaves that can be huge role players in a championship team in the next years. Let's see how AD presents itself
That guy is huge if healthy, I think people sometimes forget who he is. He's not a number one, but he can dominate games and be an unstoppable force some nights. And his bad nights are like 18/7/1blk. So if you pair him with Kyrie, which can very well happen in the FA, and have cap space to sign guys like Harrison Barnes, Grant, maybe even Wiggins or Turner and for cheap guys like Beverley, Brooks, Crowder, Kebler or Richardson

Kyrie | Nunn
Wiggins | Reaves
Barnes | Stan
AD | Kleber | Lyles
Damian Jones | Bryant

That's a very interesting team that you can assemble in 2023. And you can finally give more years of contract to guys to attract them because we are not playing Lebron's window.

It's not all doom. It can go well, we are still in a good position to prepare the future. That's why we shouldn't jump to any trade giving up Nunn or picks without actually getting assets.
Btw, if we do the trade I shared above, which I still believe unlikely, we would have Hield and no Wiggins and Turner for Kleber and Bryant which is a upgrade.

 

you are right, I don't see this season being anything else than spinning in our wheels unless we 1) get Kyrie + Curry/Harris with just 1 pick, 2) use the other pick to get another starting piece or two like Turner/Hield.

both of the above seems unlikely at the moment.

 

…. wow glasses soooo empty.

 

This is fake…

 

Had an idea that I think could work. The math is headache inducing but here we go...

Cap next summer is supposed to be $133m and tax at $161m.

Going off that Kyrie says he wants to be here and Turner has said the same in the past (reupping him should be easy), what if we trade for Turner and Hield and then go sign Kyrie next summer? This would require Bron to delay his extension. We get Turner's Bird Rights, so we worry about Kyrie first next summer and then Turner and Bron.

AD, Hield, Christie, Jones, Pip, and Swider account for roughly $64m (trading THT in this scenario). Hield will be in the last year of his deal and you can easily dump that $19m if the tax is too rich for Jeanie. So you can get that down to $45m just from the move and the two way guys are droppable if you need an extra $2m.

If you're sitting at $45m and then sign Kyrie to something around $40m a year, you still are $48m under the cap. I don't think we use much or any of that space because we're still going to pony up another $75m for Bron and Turner (maybe you can get Bron to pull a Harden but I doubt it).

Next summer you could roster
Turner/Jones
AD
Bron/Swider
Christie
Kyrie/Pip

You'll still have to go vet min bargain bin hunting for 5 players (give or take). But those 4 make for quite a formidable starting unit.

Rob gets his man crush for 1 season. Bron gets his reunion, even if it's delayed. Win-win.

I prefer depth to this option, but there's too many other agendas at play to fully go that route. I think this makes everyone in the organization with power happy.

 

not if the shooting comes with literally nothing else. we've proven that 32% shooters can become 40% shooters when lebron and AD are right. so let's find guys that defend and don't need the ball on offense. so much fussing about a couple percentage points on three point shots across wildly different contexts when there are so many other aspects of the game.

curry improved dramatically on defense over his career, and his teams have to be built to cater to his defensive limitations (e.g., they can't play poole and curry against good offenses). if buddy hield was an offensive weapon of mass destruction like these guys, i get it. but he's just not. how is this not clear, several years into his career? you can't hide him on defense, and you can't feature him on offense. he makes 22 million per, so he's not a trade asset. you don't give up anything for buddy hield.

yeah, we were terrible across the board. hield is like getting a less efficient monk back, but paying him 10x the salary.

i just wouldn't move THT because his value is at its nadir. bad business. unless it's salary filler for a clear upgrade (not hield), it doesn't make sense.

then again, everyone here just couldn't wait to move kuz, either, so this is just deja vu to me.

agree that nunn is a potentially large upgrade. another reason not to trade for hield without russ going out.

abeer3 is missing nothing here. a team without cap space may give up a 1st for turner, but no useful players. who's toronto offering? milwaukee? gs? junk, junk, junk, and a 1st that's guaranteed to be in the 20s, which is what i'd offer. if turner had great value, he'd be gone. they think we're the sucker who adds more. glad they were wrong and magic's not in charge anymore.

and we don't need his bird rights; we have cap space as it stands. teams that would offer more need to worry that we have cap space and a need at center.

and teams don't trade expirings for broken players. everyone here tells me that you can't trade russ for hayward, for example...

i don't care what indy does with russ. they're trying to lose! they'll buy him out like pretty much any trade partner will. he's an expiring contract. that is all.

anyway, it's not that i don't understand anything. it's that the pacers are in a tough spot with turner, and nobody is appreciating that at all.

and i don't care, tbh. stay away from bigs with foot issues.

 

SMH did you forget about AR?



He’ll get more than vet min for sure here or hopefully not elsewhere.

 

thought the same thing!

 

Didn't forget. He'll be a FA and on his way to Chicago.

 

but…. But….. QUOTA!!!

 

how do you dump hield if you gave up your 2 1sts to get turner/hield? how about...just don't get hield and run the same plan, flush with the rest of your assets? in either case, you're stuck with russ, right?