WMC 23-24: Whine, Moan & Complain! LET THE COMPLAINING BEGIN!

i don't think acquiring westbrook was specifically a reactionary move in response to last season

acquiring a million shooters was the reactionary move to last season because they couldn't shoot to save their lives. bringing in russ was simply a case of lebron wanting someone to take the load off him so he'd be able to coast more often and sit out when he needed to. it's smart on paper until you realize none of those shooters can play D and westbrook is a terrible fit with lebron. so instead of westbrook being "the guy" when lebron needs him to be, he's out there playing like **** while lebron continues to be forced to carry the load at all times

if they had just kept last season's team mostly intact and brought in a few shooters/wings, this team would still be a title contender

 

You don’t and you can’t. Only prayer is if someone takes his expiring deal this summer.

 

This is the brutal truth: last year team with Reaves/Howard/Monk/Melo to replace DS/Morris/Gasol/Trezz and you have a legit top 3 team.

Basically take away the Russ trade and base on what guys like AC and the wizards squad are doing

 

I don't mind trades.

Just make sure the pieces that you're getting fits what you need.

Westbrook didn't, doesn't, and won't. Horrible trade.

 

We gutted the roster by trading away valuable role players to get a big name all star. That’s a Lebron-pleasing move. He loves super teams he chases other all stars, his finger prints are all over this move. He saw Big 3s happening last year...BKN, MIL, PHX and wanted some help...it also simultaneously signals Lebron felt he and AD were not good enough.

We gave away valuable role players for someone who has redundant skills as Lebron and does not work well with him on the court. He did not value the guys who helped him win a ring in the Bubble and were rock solid defensively in 2021.

The entire cap space was blown on 3 Big names, it’s basically impossible to fill out your roster with apt role players who are supposed to be on minimum contracts.

Lebron gutted MIA and CLE rosters to surround himself with players who would help him win immediately and it took a little while to pan out.

This roster and it’s ability to improve are pretty limited until until Lebron contract ends in summer 2023


He made his bed and hes gonna have to lie in it.

 

^ Bro. Lebron brought Russ here because he needed the help. If hes gonna bring the guy in, then use him properly so he can actually help you. Russ hasnt played well and neither have Vogel/Lebron put him on spots on the floor where he is very productive.

If I remember correctly when Lebron was gone, Russ played alright with AD. We were losing games but not getting blown out and not competing like we are right now. The Russ \Lebron pairing was horrible from the beginning. They chased a big name on past laurels rather than substance...same approach with constructing the roster.

 

I’m saying he by all appearances at this stage of his career has his own reality and is “incapable” of figuring any of it out. If he could understand and humble himself to win games … he wouldn’t be this horrible fit, plus the chops I mentioned above.

 

That's how I see it. There were trades there that could've made the team better.

The front office saw how bad the team was when either LeBron or AD got hurt, wanted to make some moves, and I am okay with that in theory. The problem is they love big names and when LeBron and AD floated Russ out there they ran with it instead of shutting it down.

It was a terrible mistake. Russ doesn't fit and he's got a tough contract to move. We're just going to have to find a way to get rid of him this offseason.

 

i think my first move would be to try and get russ to accept a bench role and a contract extension at a MUCH lower number. i'd offer those things, in tandem, and say if either wasn't acceptable, we'll work to trade you or do a kemba-like buyout (he finds a MLE suitor and we cut him loose for 35 million). maybe okc will still have big cash around and will take him on for minimal compensation or something (that's a bit pipe, but i'm at a loss).

 

Making another bad move to cover up your first bad move by signing him to an extension is not the way to go. Why would we want to endure this for more seasons than we already have to????

 

I think the most likely move is we just tough it out for the remainder of the season, plus next year and just let him walk after that. That by itself is $47 million off the books.

 

Funny thing is that our best team was Pelinka's 1st, where we won the title. We need some shooting but the core and chemistry was there, rock solid.
Then he had balls and made big moves that on paper seemed perfect. Harrell/Schroder failure was not his fault and injuries blew the season. Those moves made sense on paper, skill wise, but we should have looked to the characters.
Then he makes a blockbuster move this year and signs a bunch of shooters and gets a few steals in Nunn or Monk. At the beginning of the season there was a lot of excitement, some worries with the fit and age, but there was hype. It was a disaster because we overlooked the fit.

It seems to me that we are making very bold moves that make sense in a few areas, but not in the ones that are important and help(ed) us win a title.

I don't remember last time Lebron played in a stabilized roster. He's so good that he would probably have more rings by now. I'm watching the Warriors and they play so well, even without Green and Curry, that I think Lebron would be the undeniable goat if he played in a similar well-coached/bonded team all his career lol

My thoughts exactly



Extending Russ is dangerous. I don't think it gives us much maneuver to sign someone else and I think he continues to be untradable. Teams know we are desperate, they love this

 

“Stabilized Roster?” Everywhere he goes, he guts the team when he gets there and significantly changes it again before he leaves. The dude does it to himself.

 

I don't think you can right this ship without drastic decisions. You made this god awful trade (completely eliminating your perimeter defense and YOUR IDENTITY) and didn't improve enough with outside shooting (mainly because the guy you gave up everything for can't do either).

As far as advanced metrics go, the clearest thing to look at is BPM (Box Plus/Minus) and VORP (Value over replacement player). LeBron, even at his advanced age; is still 4th in the league at BPM (behind Giannis, Jokic and Butler- but ahead of Durant, Curry and Embiid) and he is basically tied for 4th with Curry in VORP (behind again Giannis, Jokic and this time Durant) but the rest of the team leaves a lot to be desired.

Much like James DBPM (defensive end) being at a career low (1.2), that is the common theme for much of the Lakers team as well.

Rank-Player-OBPM/DBPM/BPM/VORP

4. LeBron James- 7.1/1.2/8.3/2.9
44. Anthony Davis- 2.3/0.6/2.8/1.2

It gets really sad after these two...

144. Malik Monk- 0.7/-0.9/-0.2/0.4
148. Carmelo Anthony- 0.4/-0.8/-0.5/0.4
185. Dwight Howard- -0.3/0.5/0.3/0.3
199. Russell Westbrook- -0.6/-0.8/-1.4/0.2

There are only a handful of players in the entire league who have a worse BPM than Russell Westbrook- and none of them come close to his usage (leads the NBA in minutes with 1517).

He simply doesn't fit with James on the floor and I would argue it is only worse when you go with a 2-guard lineup with him (Bradley, Monk). Bradley is your best and only decent perimeter defender but is dreadful in OBPM and Monk is just the opposite. We could use Bazemore's defense, but his OBPM is one of the worse in the NBA. Ellington, blah. THT can't shoot and that hurts what could be a plus for us (would still rather have him getting minutes over RW though).

They don't have any stretch forwards aside from AD and it shows. Ariza looks even slower. It is saying how lacking in everything we are when we are sorely missing Carmelo Anthony's game, like we were last night.

I don't know how you fix it with Westbrook on the team. You can't trade him because of his salary and although benching him is the right thing to do, that isn't going to happen.

Nunn should help and of course a healthy AD will, but does anyone even have a clue what the rotation should be or how Westbrook fits when those two come back? I don't, unless it is a drastic move.

I don't know how the trade deadline or buyout market can realistically help us either, not when you are having to trade your lone young asset and another 1st round pick just to get any conversation started about anyone meaningful- someone mind you who would only suffer as well with Westbrook getting 30 plus minutes a night.

Advocates for this trade when it went down were as clueless as Lebron/AD/Pelinka were. This was a team lacking in youth and specifically perimeter talent but still had two superstars and could win WITH DEFENSE. You sacrificed the strength of the team to get someone who was going to limit the minutes of James (which hasn't happened, and as team is constructed I doubt even with a healthy AD would it be any different) and completely ignored our strengths and how said person fit.

Absolutely depressing

 

As long as Lebron continues to get his numbers and creep up all time charts in his quest to be considered the GOAT, that’s all that really matters to him.

I’m glad fans have let him know the effort wasn’t acceptable

 

For sure, that's what I was saying! I've been adamant of how poor Lebron managed his career on that end. I absolutely hate his GM version and it still worries me the post-Lebron era, based on what Miami and Cavs went through

 

We need to stop this narrative. We can't, as fans, just be ok with that not happening.
We are the Lakers, biggest franchise in the world. We have Lebron, one of the best ever to play the game, who's nearing retirement. We can't play around. We just blew a season last year due to injuries. If AD is fit after the break, we need to do what it takes to compete in postseason.

I mean, who the f is Westbrook? Why can't he compromise in benefit of the Lakers and Lebron? No one's bigger than the team, much less Westbrook lol
Look I like the guy, I was really hoping it would work. But enough is enough. We have to play who make the team better, no other way. I'm not saying bench him for good, but bringing him off the bench and don't playing him in crunch time might really help us to win.

And it's not like we or the media or wtv are making the drama. The guy shoots awfully, can't defend jack and prefers to get a board than to box out for a teammate to grab it. That's bad basketball and if he was named Russell Farmar he would be benched.

What's the alternative? Play out 1 season and a half more, lose more than win and waste 2 seasons of Lebron so that we don't hurt the little fella? Give me a break