Log in or Sign up

LABron James Discussion: The Final Year?

Discussion in 'Lakers Discussion' started by therealdeal, Jun 8, 2017.

Page 643 of 1367

Weezy Moderator Staff Member

Joined:

Sep 6, 2014

Messages:

20,168

Likes Received:

83,319

Trophy Points:

113

Location:

Anaheim

Offline

If you make the Lakers title contenders or you even give 100% of yourself on the court in a short time as a Laker, you are a Laker. George McCloud is not a Laker, that dude looked like he’d rather be playing on the moon than here in his short time, still hate him. LeBron, is a Laker.

Weezy, Jan 22, 2020

#12841

gcclaker, LTLakerFan, JohnnyComeLately2k6 and 2 others like this.
wcsoldier81 - Lakers All Star -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

5,552

Likes Received:

10,805

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

He's really trying to score less than 82 pts in 4 games to pass Kobe at Staples

And another loss against the Floppers would be less talk about I guess

Control the narrative !

wcsoldier81, Jan 23, 2020

#12842
sirronstuff - Lakers Legend -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

33,506

Likes Received:

80,542

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

He may eventually change how people define the GOAT, but it would be an interesting definition.

you can’t out- bill Bill Russell

you can’t out peak the highest peaks of other greats

you can’t out-close the greatest closers

but there is something to be said for cumulative greatness, longevity, and turning around franchises/consistently winning

sirronstuff, Jan 23, 2020

#12843

jbiggs and karacha like this.
LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

40,391

Likes Received:

68,309

Trophy Points:

113

Location:

So Cal

Offline

He also can’t “legally” do a lot of the high speed spin moves that refs are allowing him with 3-4 steps. Kinda like how they sanction the travelling step back 3s these days. Hard play to call but on the replays in slow motion it’s clear he’s travelling on a number of them.

LTLakerFan, Jan 23, 2020

#12844
JSM - Lakers Legend -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

21,055

Likes Received:

82,747

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

It's nice to see him engaged defensively

JSM, Jan 23, 2020

#12845

abeer3, JohnnyComeLately2k6, LTLakerFan and 3 others like this.
TIME Administrator Staff Member

Joined:

Sep 6, 2014

Messages:

6,143

Likes Received:

24,322

Trophy Points:

113

Occupation:

Lifelong Lakers fan.

Location:

LaLa Land

Offline

JSM said: ↑

It's nice to see him engaged defensively

Click to expand...

He may not give that level effort on D every game in the regular season, but it's good to know he will be able to turn it up for the playoffs.

TIME, Jan 23, 2020

#12846

JohnnyComeLately2k6, LTLakerFan and sirronstuff like this.
LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

40,391

Likes Received:

68,309

Trophy Points:

113

Location:

So Cal

Offline

Like your new avi Time. Bout time you got rid of the creepy one.

LTLakerFan, Jan 23, 2020

#12847

Jaguar, JohnnyComeLately2k6 and TIME like this.
lakerjones Moderator Staff Member

Joined:

Sep 7, 2014

Messages:

11,386

Likes Received:

34,386

Trophy Points:

113

Location:

La La land

Offline

Another triple double. Tenth on the year. This guy is just unreal.

lakerjones, Jan 23, 2020

#12848

Juronimo, LTLakerFan, Jaguar and 5 others like this.
JSM - Lakers Legend -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

21,055

Likes Received:

82,747

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

He was +26. Very efficient game from Bron. Wondering if he goes easy against Philly offensively so he'll pass Kobe at home.

Energy wise, he's looking good. He has his legs even in the 4th Q on a back to back. He was dancing out there on the perimeter with pep in his step. I know we're only at the half way point, but that's a good sign in my book.

JSM, Jan 24, 2020

#12849

JohnnyComeLately2k6, karacha, Juronimo and 3 others like this.
wcsoldier81 - Lakers All Star -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

5,552

Likes Received:

10,805

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

He'll play bully ball in the playoffs in the post this is the good news .

Bad news is he has a LOT of drouble going at the rim minus the spin move in transition.

Couldn't get by Joe Harris on a 1 on 1 situation .

Still a very good game

wcsoldier81, Jan 24, 2020

#12850
karacha Moderator Staff Member

Joined:

Sep 6, 2014

Messages:

9,599

Likes Received:

31,182

Trophy Points:

113

Online

JSM said: ↑

He was +26. Very efficient game from Bron. Wondering if he goes easy against Philly offensively so he'll pass Kobe at home.

Energy wise, he's looking good. He has his legs even in the 4th Q on a back to back. He was dancing out there on the perimeter with pep in his step. I know we're only at the half way point, but that's a good sign in my book.
Click to expand...

It seems to me he is load managing himself - not by missing games, because he's too good for that - but taking it easy from time to time. Which is fascinating, because Bron taking it easy is still better than most players in the league.

karacha, Jan 24, 2020

#12851

JohnnyComeLately2k6, wallangong, LTLakerFan and 2 others like this.
LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

40,391

Likes Received:

68,309

Trophy Points:

113

Location:

So Cal

Offline

The guy is smart enough to know how to not beat himself up to the point of having nothing for the playoffs. He's playing like Magic would have played had he lasted that long, but with a stronger and more resilient body.

LTLakerFan, Jan 24, 2020

#12852

JohnnyComeLately2k6 likes this.
wallangong - Lakers 6th Man -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

1,878

Likes Received:

5,797

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

karacha said: ↑

It seems to me he is load managing himself - not by missing games, because he's too good for that - but taking it easy from time to time. Which is fascinating, because Bron taking it easy is still better than most players in the league.
Click to expand...

Basically if there’s any game where he’s settling for 5-10 unnecessary 3s, that’s the load management equivalent of Kawhi sitting an entire game.

wallangong, Jan 24, 2020

#12853

JohnnyComeLately2k6, LTLakerFan and karacha like this.
karacha Moderator Staff Member

Joined:

Sep 6, 2014

Messages:

9,599

Likes Received:

31,182

Trophy Points:

113

Online

^
LOL, almost.

karacha, Jan 24, 2020

#12854

JohnnyComeLately2k6, LTLakerFan and wallangong like this.
Pioneer10 - Lakers All Star -

Joined:

Jul 4, 2019

Messages:

6,958

Likes Received:

19,152

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

When you factor in James' scoring and his passing, he has his hand in over 52 points per game: 25 as a scorer, 27 as a passer.

We've become so accustomed to James' brilliance over the past 16 years that we're at risk of failing to appreciate the nuances of his third act. He ranks No. 1 both in ESPN's real plus-minus (RPM) -- measuring his holistic on-court impact -- and in defensive RPM, a reflection of how engaged he's been on that end.
Click to expand...

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/28538415/lebron-james-making-real-nba-mvp-race

Pioneer10, Jan 24, 2020

#12855

JohnnyComeLately2k6 likes this.
Pioneer10 - Lakers All Star -

Joined:

Jul 4, 2019

Messages:

6,958

Likes Received:

19,152

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

karacha said: ↑

It seems to me he is load managing himself - not by missing games, because he's too good for that - but taking it easy from time to time. Which is fascinating, because Bron taking it easy is still better than most players in the league.
Click to expand...

Lebron's been load managing in season since he left Miami. That last year in Cleveland was infuriating to a lot of fans as he would be a statue on defense for whole quarters then turn it on in the 4th. He was to his credit absolutely sensation in the playoffs: that game 1 loss to the Durant Warriors was about as close to a perfect game as you can get.

Pioneer10, Jan 24, 2020

#12856

JohnnyComeLately2k6 likes this.
Weezy Moderator Staff Member

Joined:

Sep 6, 2014

Messages:

20,168

Likes Received:

83,319

Trophy Points:

113

Location:

Anaheim

Offline

It was pretty impressive.

Weezy, Jan 24, 2020

#12857

JohnnyComeLately2k6 and Kenzo like this.
fabfourlakers - Lakers Starter -

Joined:

Oct 19, 2014

Messages:

3,705

Likes Received:

8,515

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

Just PLEASE show up against the Clippers - Sick of seeing him not show up against Kawhi.

fabfourlakers, Jan 24, 2020

#12858

OX1947 likes this.
OX1947 - Lakers MVP -

Joined:

Jun 3, 2016

Messages:

8,753

Likes Received:

18,483

Trophy Points:

113

Offline

fabfourlakers said: ↑

Just PLEASE show up against the Clippers - Sick of seeing him not show up against Kawhi.
Click to expand...

This.

OX1947, Jan 24, 2020

#12859

LTLakerFan likes this.
wcsoldier81 - Lakers All Star -

Joined:

Oct 5, 2014

Messages:

5,552

Likes Received:

10,805

Trophy Points:

113

Offline
Worth the read

6
There’s one noticeable area of decline in LeBron’s game, and the Lakers are at a loss to explain it.

By Michael Pina Jan 24, 2020, 10:33am ESTShare this on Facebook

Share this on Twitter

SHAREAll sharing options

Getting to the foul line has been an unfamiliar problem for LeBron James this year.
Relative to every other segment of his game, LeBron James’ career-long relationship with the free-throw line has wobbled between feelings of discomfort and outright hostility. Getting there has never been a problem, though.

James has attempted and made more free throws than any other active player. In NBA history, only five (Moses Malone, Wilt Chamberlain, Shaquille O’Neal, Karl Malone, and Kobe Bryant, who he will pass sometime over the next few months) have shot more.

But this year LeBron has dealt with something altogether unfamiliar. With so many of his current numbers either right in line with a career average or even higher than ever before (such as three-point attempts and assists), it’s his drop in free-throw attempts that sticks out like a sore thumb.

Right now he’s averaging 5.4 per game, which is good for 22nd best in the league. Not including last season, when he only appeared in 55 games, he’s never finished lower than 15th, and that happened when he was a rookie.

LeBron’s career average coming into this season was 8.1 free-throw attempts per game. Last year he attempted 7.6. To go a bit deeper, his free-throw rate heading into this season was .413. Right now it’s lower than ever before at .274, and for the very first time it’s below his three-point rate.

Also, the Lakers’ free-throw rate drops 5.7 points with James on the court, taking them from the top five to the bottom five, per Cleaning the Glass. which is one of the worst marks at his position and a total abnormality from everything we’ve seen out of him since he was drafted.

Why is this happening? Is he taking fewer shots around the basket or attacking less frequently than he did when he was younger? Not really. LeBron’s usage rate is only 0.1 percent below his career average, and there’s no real decline from recent seasons in the percentage of shots he takes at the rim. Half of LeBron’s points are scored in the paint, too, a mark he’s only topped four times.

Both he and the Lakers are perplexed, and have used inconsistent officiating to explain what’s happening. LeBron was averaging 5.6 free throws per game before he made zero trips to the line in a November 23rd win against the Memphis Grizzlies. After that game, Lakers head coach Frank Vogel told reporters that LA would “go through the proper channels” in addressing the matter with the league.

At the time, James said “I’m living in the paint, and if you look at my arm right here, these are four or five [scratches] that happened the last two games, and they weren’t called at all. But that can’t stop me. It didn’t stop me tonight.

No matter what, I got to continue to go, but being able to get to the free-throw line is something that allows our defense to get in good position. It sets our defense. It slows the game down at times. It gives us a good rhythm. It relaxes me as well. So, I know I’m getting hit, but at the end of the day I just got to keep going.”

But since that doughnut in Memphis, his attempts have actually gone down to 5.3 per game, in about the same number of minutes.

The NBA declined to comment for this story on any specific complaints logged by the Lakers, but such a thing is far from uncommon. Teams use what’s called a Team Inquiry Website (TIW) to inform the league of any particular calls they didn’t agree with or were curious about after every game. Those examples are then reviewed by the NBA’s referee operations staff (43 people) who clarify why certain calls went the way they did. It’s a process that not only lets the league know how teams are feeling about certain players or situations, but also allows teams to better understand what is and isn’t going to get called by the refs in a game situation.

Earlier this week, I asked Vogel if he had any further clue as to why James still wasn’t getting to the line as often as he normally does. “I mean, it’s difficult to say. He’s going to the basket. We send clips in all the time to the league office, in terms of why he’s not getting calls,” he said. “I’m not trying to turn this into a complaint or anything, I’m just answering your question. But he’s still going to the basket the same way he always has.”

When I asked LeBron for an updated explanation for the sudden decrease, he either didn’t have or wasn’t willing to offer his own theory. “I have no idea.”

It’s strange. LeBron is actually averaging more drives this season than he has since tracking data became publicly available seven years ago. Right now he’s tallying 13.8 drives per game. In reverse chronological order starting with the 2018-19 season, his drives have been 12.4, 11.7, 11.3, 11.1, 13.2, and 9.4, which occurred in his last year with the Miami Heat.

This season, those 13.8 drives are generating 1.7 free-throw attempts per game. For added context, this year Giannis Antetokounmpo’s 11.1 drives get him 3.0 free-throw attempts per game. Zach LaVine’s 12.0 drives earn him 2.5 free-throw attempts.

Back in 2014, LeBron was getting 2.1 free-throw attempts per game off those 9.4 drives. During the 2015 season, when he drove the ball 13.2 times every night, he was rewarded with 2.9 free-throw attempts per game.

Another way to explain the drop in free-throw attempts might be thanks to the percentage of his minutes spent in the bonus, which is a career-low 20.46 percent. That’s over five percent lower than last season. His career average is 28.06 percent. But that doesn’t account for the fact that he’s also averaging the fewest drawn fouls of his career, non-shooting included.

It’s all curious, but somewhat expected. Only 15 players have ever averaged more than 5.5 free-throw attempts per game after their 35th birthday. Father Time is undefeated, and even though LeBron remains explosive, physical decline is visibly evident. He gets 1.4 of his shots blocked per 100 possessions, which is, by a hair, the highest mark of his career.

Lakers forward Jared Dudley has a few possible reasons. The first is LeBron’s unwillingness to flop. “LeBron hasn’t adapted yet — I told him this — to the flopping. Giannis came out the other day and said they reward flopping. We just played James [Harden] the other day and, you know, him and Luka [Doncic]. It’s a talent that fans might not like, but it’s rewarded. And the snapping of the neck, LeBron is just so big and strong that he’s getting bumped but he’s not using his head.”

According to Dudley, another cause might be the way all aging players need to adjust in how they attack the rim. Instead of barreling forward with a cannonball first step that forces defenders to hack away, older LeBron needs to be more methodical and patient. “He still has you,” Dudley said. “He has you on your side. He just finishes strong over you.”

The amount of pick-and-roll he plays with Anthony Davis might also be a factor, where dropping bigs are simultaneously occupied by the game’s fiercest lob threat and a driving LeBron. Coverages have changed over the past few years, too, with more bigs hanging back in the paint than stepping out and being aggressive at the point of attack. “LeBron, every game, is playing 2-on-2,” Dudley said. (The percentage of his points that come from the free-throw line nearly cuts in half when Davis is not on the floor, per NBA.com.)

Whether it be referees suddenly deciding to swallow their whistles, age, pace, or any other combination of factors that mix in to create a perfect storm of statistical decline, the next step is to ask if any of this actually matters.

So far, it hasn’t kept LeBron from another MVP-caliber season. He leads the league in assists, the Lakers are dominant when he’s on the court and stink when he’s not, etc. Not even a relatively low true shooting percentage that hasn’t been seen since his early 20s is cause for much concern. The Lakers are one of the NBA’s three best teams and James is their on-court auteur.

He averaged 9.7 free-throw attempts over the past two playoffs. But the year before that, during which LeBron won a championship with the Cavaliers, he only manufactured 5.9. The free-throw line obviously does not define his impact.

But this could also be a canary in the coal mine, a sign of deterioration that will soon seep into other areas that James used to physically dominate. Free throws not only keep him efficient, but they also allow the Lakers to set up their dominant half-court defense and play at a steadier pace, one LeBron has flourished in throughout his life. (The Lakers have by far the NBA’s best defense after they make a free throw.) Believe it or not: Free shots are more conducive to winning than missed layups.

Maybe the free-throw drop is nothing, and the Lakers will still win the title despite James getting to the line much less than he did before. Or maybe, in a series decided by the slimmest of margins, his inability to draw fouls as often as he used to will haunt LA in myriad ways. Either way, this development is connected to the inevitable atrophy of arguably the NBA’s best player. That matters, even if LeBron is able to neutralize it for another year.
Click to expand...
wcsoldier81, Jan 25, 2020

#12860

(You must log in or sign up to reply here.)

Page 643 of 1367

Share This Page