Avery Bradley Discussion

his shot has been off all yr....more time isnt going to change that, he started off the yr bad went thru a "decent" stretch and now it's utterly worse than when the season started

 

Started slow. Shot started coming around. Got hurt. It’s been an issue since. I’m not calling him a lights out shooter, but he’s better than this recent stretch.

The point remains, if you can’t see his defensive abilities and how much he harasses the other team’s best ball handler, then you’re not paying attention. That’s the beauty of our roster, if we need more offense, we have several guys that can step in. None of our other guards can play man defense like Avery, and Avery can’t shoot as well some of the others. As I said, if he could, we wouldn’t have gotten him for $5M.

 

and youre living on past rep to conture what you perceive as "defense".....have you not seen what the team has given up scoring wise? did you not see how bos lite it up? walker got anything he wanted even w/o screens....Bradley hounding D is no different than Sasha, looks good effort wise but end of the day he still.cant stop his man and just fouls constantly. N no his shooting isnt as good as any other guard, its actually a detriment to the team now, the dude is shooting 26% from 3s, his adv metrics also says hes not a good defender....def rating of 109 (fyi the higher the # the worse it is), he has a negative dbpm.of -.4, a negative vorp of -.3....basically hes pure negative player.... see what you wanna see stats don't lie

 

Right off the bat, referencing overall team scoring is absolutely not an argument against any individual player. Completely invalid argument. Our whole team was pathetic in Boston and you're going to use that to single out Bradley?

Now, in regard to the metrics. Aggressive defenders like him will get burnt a few times a game, but the rest of the time they're hounding the other team. Do you really think Kyrie only wanted to take 17 shots last night? What stats don't tell you is how much of a pain in the butt Avery was for Kyrie and how hard he made him work for everything. There were multiple times where Avery dictated where Kyrie would go so he couldn't get the shot off. You probably didn't see it because you were too busy spewing Bradley hate in gametime, but it was consistent in his 20 minutes. There's also times where a team defensive scheme involves funneling guys to the rim. If there's a defensive breakdown, that will go against the defender who was originally guarding the player. Considering we put Avery on the opposing team's best ballhandler literally every night, it makes sense for him to pay the price in rating.

Also, you've brought up sample size in the Avery debate since last offseason when it came to his strong finish to the season in Memphis. If you want to make that argument, then I'll counter by saying I'll weigh his career 36% three point shooting over his 26% this year.

You also didn't read my post clearly. I never said his shooting was as good as any other guard and in fact, I said the opposite, but I haven't seen another guard on our team be able to keep up with other PGs. When we need offense, put in KCP, Daniels, or Cook.

So in conclusion, feel free to keep seeing what you want to see, but I'm going to keep trusting my eyes.

 

yes i see bricks n fouls n adv metrics metrics dont lie either unlike perception.....perimeter def ties to bradley because his man is getting past him n causing havoc in the paint, forcing others to help him leading to open 3s

 

Cool story. I could easily dig deeper into the stats to tell a different story (already looked), but you’ve been on the anti-AB crusade for a while so I’d rather go play pick up ball than waste my energy. Keep on keeping on.

 

so is he injured or this was the injury before LOL

 

show me this other stat then. ive backuped my narrative vs "what i see" stuff...im not anti anything other anti players who are detrimental to overall success of the team, which bradley clearly is

 

It's not a different stat. It's analyzing and digging deeper. Look up his defensive rtg in wins versus losses (23-8 when you account for games missed due to injury). I could make a case that his defense is so good that when he's off we lose, though I'm not actually going that far. Or there's the likely scenario that when we're bad as a team, he's as guilty as anyone. The good thing is his average rating in 75% of our games is very good and in the games he's bad, so is everyone else.

Also, if we're talking small samples sizes, let's look at his shooting in the last 10 games:
Last 5: 0-10 (0%)
5 Before That: 8-14 (57%)

He's not as bad or good as either stretch, but somewhere in between and likely within a point or 2 of his career average.

 

This is the 1st step of the dream , the 2nd step is dreaming of Rondo not playing at all even after Collison signs.

Caruso will be the one who plays less

 

this what I dont get, Rondo gets so much hate but he actually contributes, alot more than Bradley

 

Rondo has a 2.5 to 1 assist turnover ratio. He rebounds 50% better. They score exactly the same amount of points per game
Their steals are the same.

But AB is a defensive bulldog who held Dame to 48 points so let that false narrative continue.

(They are both mediocre but at least Rondo was great at one point in his career and might bring it in the playoffs)

https://www.basketball-reference.co...ondo&y2=2020&player_id2=rondora01&idx=players

 

The eye test tho

 

the advanced stats on basketball reference have them as pretty equally not useful.

but yeah, watching rondo is more annoying for whatever reason. maybe because it seems like his badness could be avoidable if he cared more. i mean, how is it that he seems to play well pretty much every time we face a team he's mad at? why not play like that all the time? what message are you sending as a leader? i find it hard to believe that his apparent good game last night against sac was random. he plays half that well against portland and we don't have an unnecessary home loss.

anyway, this is the bradley thread. glad to see he made a few threes. that would be a game-changer if it kept up.

 

The eye test can be affected by one's personal bias.

Because KCP would make some glaring mistakes running fast break transition offense... I thought of him as terrible at making turnovers.

Then I looked up his stats and found he doesn't really make a lot of turnovers (mostly because he never runs the offense, but still)

My point is that although Rondo has been disappointing, he gets all the hate and Bradley gets much less because of preconceived biases that Rondo is terrible and AB is great at defense.

The stats show they are the same... maybe Rondo even better.

What abeer said about Rondo might be true though... he's more irritating because he looks like he's playing in a more lackadaisical manner. LBJ does the same of course, but he does so many other good things that it doesn't matter. As LBJ ages though he should stop, because that's something one can fix in old age. Rondo also should do the same. It's one thing to make errors because of lack of ability... it's another to make them because of lack of concentration or effort.

 

Yeah, that's where body language comes in. And timing.

Make a turnover at a bad moment vs early in the game, and fans want your head.

 

538 Raptor has Bradley as bad on offense and basically a net zero defense. Rondo is bad on defense and basically a net zero on offense

This pretty much averages what I see from the eye test. The problem with Bradley on defense while he is good on the eye test as a ball hawk he is a bad defensive rebounder even as a guard and he doesn't have length or size to contest on jumpshots so it all balances out.

Rondo has been terrible on defense for 2 years and Rondo for every good pass he makes he screws up the spacing and does stupid s***. Plus LeBron's crazy adjusted plus minus is in part due to how bad Rondo is as a backup PG He's had decent games against bad teams and has just put stinkers consistently against good teams. Don't trust him at all as I suspect his +/- would drop like a rock against if filtered by good teams

 

Ummm ..... BUMP?

21 points and the extra work on his shot he started putting in a couple weeks ago seems to have him back at that nice shooting level he had at the start of the season before he got hurt.