Lakers Coaching Search Discussion: Going Ham?

self-interest? i'm confused. not moving westbrook and a 1st for wall was a self-interested decision?

 

it's just an angle i wasn't anticipating. i guess i don't see rob as having plans as a basketball ops guy post-lakers. but maybe i'm wrong about that.

like, daryl morey made some moves that i thought were clearly about bolstering daryl morey moreso than the houston rockets. i don't get that vibe from rob or most gms, really.

 

I think it was the most beneficial for the team as it had the pick involved. Don't see that angle

 

I totally agree with this. I don't think many people could've seen Vogel to be so successful for us after the drama that happened with Magic leaking stuff out and the fact we failed to get Lue.

With Kidd, being an assistant with us made him much more prepared this time around. He jumped into coaching after being a player, so he probably didn't learn all the nuances of coaching.

I think if we can get a promising hire (and our team stays healthy), there's a good chance we'll be back in it again next year.

As for the whole Westbrook thing, perhaps he can eat his ego a bit and change his game for the better for his team like Howard did. We can't just place all the onus on coaching to "fit" him in.

 

:THT Heart Hands:

 

I’ve been on the side of Russ stays. Not because I’m a Russ stan like some will call me. I just think it’s the best short and long term outcome.

Long term is obvious; we get out of 1/3rd of the cap in a season, don’t take on any long term salary and don’t lose any assets.

Short term is more nuanced, I believe Houston or Washington Russ is a net positive player and is the best player in any scenario of what we get back for a current trade for him. So it’s on him, on Lebron and AD and most importantly on our new coach on how to maximise him.

To that effect, we need to improve the pieces around our starting 3 if we want to have any success. That’s why I’ve suggested we swing for the fences with:

Russ / Nunn
TJ Warren (mMLE) / Reaves
Lebron / Stan
AD / Melo
Lopez (trade for THT) / Jones

We’d probably close out with Russ, Nunn, TJ, Lebron, AD.

It’s going to be really tough because you want to maximise Russ in transition and space, while slowing things down for Lebron to close. It’s a challenge for sure.

 

I agree about Vogel but getting the right players on the court at the right time is a huge part of coaching. Lebron is just going to do what he does, no coach is going to have any influence on him. I don't see anyway to fairly judge a new coach till Lebron is gone. Especially so, with Jeanie stating she wants to keep Lebron happy. I support Jeanie but this is a bad move. Do what is best for the team, it isn't keeping Lebron happy.

 

Vogel is a great coach with a lot of qualities. He just isn’t great on the offensive end and this season we didn’t give him great defensive players.

He couldn’t maximise AD or Russ. And we can blame Lebron ball to an extent for that as well.

As an aside, Kidd has done a great job on coaching defence with the Mavs and running Lebron ball with shooters. Doncic is young enough and strong enough to do it for a whole post season. It’s honestly entertaining to watch because you don’t expect a relatively out of shape kid to dominate.

 

i agree. i'm not sure i think that washington/houston russ is still in there, though. feel like frank saw that and just didn't know what to do.

 

Yeah you’re probably right. The only reason I hold out hope is because right before he came to the lakers he had his best stretch since his MVP season. So I question how one goes from that to being shot in 3-4 months.

Either way, I’m fine with not taking on long term rubbish and letting him expire. I don’t think Lebron has it in him to be AD’s running partner for another ring at his age anyway. Hopefully we can retool and wait for Giannis or Luka to fall to us.

Would anyone try to trade for Ayton or CP3 after PHX bowing out like that?

 

i think the issue becomes what defines "rubbish". due to his incredibly high salary, it's actually hard to trade for russ and get pure garbage back. teams don't just have 50 million in trash laying around on their roster. it was part of our problem in trading for him. we HAD to give up useful talent, even if washington didn't even really care.

as for the other questions: i think russ for cp3 makes some sense for us but not at all for phx. just terrible optics for them. and as i've said for years now, maybe you just stay away from paul because i don't think he has 25 consecutive games in him. he proved me wrong last year, but this year, there it was again. he's 37. does he have another last year in him? guessing no.

i don't think ayton's a star, personally. he's not good enough offensively to have to work around him on defense the way philly and denver do for embiid and jokic. he's more like gobert (though much better offensively but not as good defensively). if your center can't defend credibly on the perimeter, you have to build the team around defensive coverages that protect that. it's obviously possible, but how many other choices are you making to make that work? ayton's not worth it to me. now, if i'm say, the detroit pistons right now...i'm looking into it. if you're starting from scratch with an eye towards maximizing ayton, maybe you can build something.

something else i've said since we played them in the playoffs is that phx was going to have issues a) as paul declined and b) as they had to start paying people. i know we disagree, but i still think bridges was an overpay, and these matter for teams with owners like sarver (and ours, *laugh/cries*). so now you've got paul on a max-level deal, booker on a supermax (?, yikes), ayton on a max, and bridges on a 3/4 max. how much do you have to pay crowder, cam johnson, and role players? i'm guessing they try to s&t ayton to a team with space for some assets, actually.

back to coaching, i don't think the lakers asking guys what they're planning to do with russ is smoke or data gathering in terms of strategy. i think it's data gathering in terms of whether any coaches think they can use russ (a debate we've had here and they have to be having in the FO). would be interesting to be a fly on the wall and hear if anyone sounds legitimately convinced that we just didn't have the right formula last year.

 

I expect that question has been answered like this by these candidates


Or they just end the zoom call right then and there

 

Vogel didn't have a clue on offense and he got fired. He deserved it, he had 3 good seasons in Indy, then 2 subpar ones, he got fired. He had two subpar seasons in Orlando and got fired. He won a chip here, and then had two subpar seasons and got fired. Two consecutive subpar seasons will get you fired in the NBA. That's the way it goes. Excuses aside, if he gets another gig and start off with two subpar seasons, guess what? He will get fired again.

 

After his performance here last season, I seriously doubt, that anyone will be calling Fiz about a HC job anytime soon either.

 

Back off Charlotte… just go with D’antoni