Las Vegas Massacre

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion and Philosophy -(FORUM CLOSED)-' started by therealdeal, Oct 2, 2017.

  1. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    The man's girlfriend said that he showed absolutely zero signs of any of this. The police and FBI can't find signs of him planning this other than the weapons.

    Was this man a retired covert operative in the CIA or something? What the f*** nonsense is this that I'm supposed to buy he was just a "nutcase"? C'mon. A nutcase sneaks a handgun into a theater and shoots a few people running away (Aurora). A nutcase doesn't have 50 guns, bipods, tactical cameras set up, with the perfect angle for a kill zone. This was as calculated an event as you could possibly imagine when it comes to this sort of thing.
     
  2. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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  3. Azndude2190

    Azndude2190 - Lakers 6th Man -

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    Well yea, a calculating nutcase. The two things aren’t necessarily mutually exclusive. I don’t think he instantly snapped, but something happened mentally within the last year or two. Recent reports say he amassed most of his guns within the past 12 months and that he was scouting out other festivals.
     
  4. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    You're willing to believe a 64 year old retiree with no prior military experience was capable of all of this? Meticulously planning this out, scouting the location, amassing the weapons in a way that didn't set off alarms, keeping his family and friends out of the loop, and then of course pulling off the plan with the perfect firing range and aim, with a scouting camera set outside to keep track of interfering movement.

    All of that sounds reasonable? That's a massive leap of faith to take all that at face value.
     
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  5. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    Even a highly trained shooter would have difficulty keeping his fire steady at 1300 feet range from a 300 foot elevation platform within a few degrees firing window on the target.
     
  6. Azndude2190

    Azndude2190 - Lakers 6th Man -

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    He didn’t need to keep his fire steady. Spray and pray with attached bump stocks on multiple rifles + 22,000 people is going to cause 59 dead and 500+ wounded
     
  7. Azndude2190

    Azndude2190 - Lakers 6th Man -

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    Yes?
     
  8. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    I have a bridge I could sell you.
     
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  9. Azndude2190

    Azndude2190 - Lakers 6th Man -

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    Why though?

    Alot of what you mentioned, I could be wrong, but it's not beyond reasonable. There were reports he was scouting other festivals both in Vegas and other U.S. cities. So that tells me it was a long term plan. Second, it's perfectly normal for a person to buy several guns at the same time to save money on DROS fees. In CA, we are limited to 1 handgun per 30 days, but in other states, especially Nevada, there are no restrictions and waiting periods. Transporting 20+ guns from his car to his hotel room is also not that hard. You make a few trips and conceal the firearms and ammo in backpacks, duffel bags, suit cases, etc.

    And he doesn't need military experience and be a good shot to kill and injure the amount of people he did. He was firing from a elevated position and had the element of surprise. And with 22,000 people attending the festival in close proximity to each other, spray and pray with automatic like weapons, is sadly a matter of statistics. If he was well trained the numbers killed and injured would have been likely higher, that and law enforcement were relatively quick to act.

    The cameras setup outside, he probably set up right before he started the murder rampage and housekeeping at Vegas hotels aren't always spot on with taking away trays or carts left outside. So he likely had a few hour window between housekeeping sweeps.

    The only thing that I agree is kind of skeptical is the fact that he was able to hide all his weaponry at his Nevada house from his live in girlfriend without her knowing.
     
  10. John3:16

    John3:16 Moderator Staff Member

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    I'm with @Azndude2190 here. 22,000 people in attendance. You can fart in that direction and you're gonna hit a few. I can't answer everything, but getting guns and ammo into the room is pretty easy IMO. Pointing and holding down the trigger is also easy. Spray and Pray, as mentioned. Everything else about this guy I can't explain and I admit a lot of it doesn't make sense to me. I find the timing very interesting (convenient) whether you're a conspiracy theorist or not. As I've said, I don't put anything past our government.
     
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  11. revgen

    revgen - Lakers 6th Man -

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    The retired Army lieutenant colonel in the LA Times article says otherwise.

    He says that the killer had to have training of some sort to pull off what he did. It's wasn't spray and pray.
     
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  12. John3:16

    John3:16 Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't doubt he had some training.

    As I've said many times, I've very Pro 2nd Amendment and am against banning guns / ammo, but if Auto weapons are against the law, this Bump Stock should be banned too. However, I don't think this is really want the Dems want. Or should I say, they won't stop at that.
     
  13. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    Training when? From whom? He wasn't in the military, the police, or a security team (two of which wouldn't train with automatic weapons). His live in girlfriend said he showed no signs of any of this. If he spent a year training shooting automatic weapons, wouldn't she be aware of that? My wife would. And that's just shooting, that doesn't include planning.

    Especially to this level of detail. The man was armed like the Punisher. That doesn't just happen with some wacko. The police and the FBI aren't even convinced, I'm not sure how you guys are to be honest.
     
  14. Savory Griddles

    Savory Griddles Moderator Staff Member

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    I certainly am not. I think someone, at the very least, helped him or just flat out made him the fall guy.

    I am not a conspiracy guy. They only "conspiracy" I believe is JFK. I don't know who killed him, but I know it wasn't Lee Harvey Oswald by himself with that piece of crap rifle hitting Kennedy with speed and precision that would impress an elite sniper. I look at the Vegas shooting the same way. I'm not saying it's the government or Russian spies or some shadow organization, but it wasn't a 65 year old retired video poker player acting alone.
     
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  15. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    That's what I'm saying. Either this man isn't who we think he was or there was more involved than just him. The conspiracy theorist in me can go to really deep, dark places with this story, but I think the easier one is that he wasn't alone or he wasn't acting alone or it flat out wasn't him. There's got to be more to the story than just one old man keeping one of the country's biggest secrets to himself.
     
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  16. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    Some small details released that belong in the does not fit the official narrative category.

    His room key card was used during the same time when his car was driven off the property. A phone charger was found in the room that did not correspond to any of his devices.
     
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  17. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    I listened to an interview with the police captain in Vegas. He said that they are convinced this man was the only man in the room at the time.

    There was a security feature set to the door of the room that went off which alerted the hotel staff. One man went to check on the door, when he got there the shooter opened fire on the door (probably saw him using the stealth camera hidden outside). The worker was hit in the leg, but was able to alert the staff to which door/room the shooter was in. This is why the police are convinced nobody else was in the room, they had eyes on the door relatively early in the process. This incident actually forced the shooter to stop shooting towards the concert which probably saved a lot of lives.

    The FBI and the police department still have zero motive for the shooter. The closest anyone can come is the shooter's father who was a criminal and some are suggesting it may be a psychological issue with the family, but it still doesn't fit really. The father was a serial bank robber and a thug, not a calculated mass murderer.
     
  18. Barnstable

    Barnstable Supreme Fuzzler of Lakersball.com Staff Member

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    I haven't heard the interview myself, but I was listening to NPR and a reporter was saying the terrorist's brother was doing an interview, and he sounded like he was almost bragging about his brother. Like how wealthy the terrorist was and how he was such a nice guy. They said the brother didn't sound in any way impacted by what his brother had done, so it lead the reporter to wonder if some kind of mental illness just ran in the family, especially after knowing that the father was a bank robber.
     
  19. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    I heard that too, but I've seen the video of when his brother first heard the news and he is reacting the way I'd expect someone in this situation to react.
     
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  20. John3:16

    John3:16 Moderator Staff Member

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