Trade Down To Obtain Player And Retain A To Top Pick?

Discussion in 'Lakers Discussion' started by southbaylakers72, May 22, 2015.

  1. southbaylakers72

    southbaylakers72 - Rookie -

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    If you could trade down for a starter, a potential all-star and still have a Top 10 pick - would you do it?

    Demarcus Cousins plus Sacto Pick for No. 2, No. 27 and filler?

    What about if it were a deal for Lawson and Denver Pick?

    I'm not a fan of getting fancy but wonder what types of offers the Lakers are getting as I recall last year for the No. 7, Philly was trying to unload Kidd-Gilcrest, Thad Young, etc. We know that Lawson and Cousins are on the block so I am all but certain they are being dangled.

    Personally, I love having three picks in this draft and think its a lot deeper than the experts are talking about. I guess my only thought is that we know (Wesley Johnson, Jordan Hill, Kendall Marshall, Michael Beasley, Michael Olawakandi, Sam Bowie, Greg Oden and the list goes on) that high draft pick (even top 10) does not guarantee a Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan, Steph Curry, Westbrook, Durant - its about the talent and for everyone who loves Okafor, or who can make the case for Russell, or Townes, or Mudiay - has to admit that these guys don't come with a 'guarantee' - and thus the argument for a rebuilding team with cap space to consider grabbing a 'sure thing' (proven player, warts and all) where they might also still be able to grab a player who falls (Julius Randle, Kobe Bryant, Jordan Clarkson, Tony Parker, etc) with a later pick.

    Remember - we are playing with 'house money' now - as we risked losing the pick all together.

    I'm for trusting youth and not picking up someone else's failures or attitude problems - what do you say?
     
  2. KareemtheGreat33

    KareemtheGreat33 - Lakers MVP -

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    Yeah, Cousins and their pick. I want Hezonja for it.
     
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  3. JSM

    JSM - Lakers Legend -

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    Cousins is the only star on the block I'd entertain. I want no part of the children on the Nuggets. Those grown a** men behaved in a manner which they should be ashamed (phones during film sessions, partying too much, having to have practices pushed to later in the day, quitting on Shaw). I don't want any of that stink around our impressionable youth.

    The thing with Cousins is he is what he is. He's not going to change. He grew up a lot this season, but he's still a basket case. That's risky. What if he doesn't get along with a tough coach like Scott. What if he doesn't want to hear what Kobe has to say. With the spotlight of LA on him, I'm not sure he could hack it. We can't afford an implosion or a troubled locker room. I'd rather have a top talent prospect that is eager to listen, who doesn't have character concerns, who you can mold into whatever you want him to be. Our development game has been shockingly stellar as of late. Trust in that.

    Unless we can take serious advantage of some team in a trade, I keep the pick and don't look back.
     
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  4. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    If Sacramento called me and said "we'll give you Boogie and our pick for #2 and #27"... I might say yes to that actually.

    I know Cousins is a headcase, but with him AND #6 that's an awesome deal. You pick Hezonja or Stan Johnson and you've just rebuilt your team in one summer. You've still got 10 million dollars to spend on backups. You like Jeremy Lin? Tell him he's the captain of our second unit for the next four years. You don't like him? Fine me neither. Sign Mo Williams for 4-5 million for 3 years, he's a solid veteran who can lead a squad the right way. Sign Ed Davis to be our captain off the bench for 5-6 million for 4 years.

    Clarkson/Williams/Price
    Bryant/Ellington/Brown
    Stan Johnson/Young
    Randle/Black/Kelly
    Cousins/Davis

    I mean damn. I love Okafor/Towns but damn... That's a hell of a squad tomorrow.
     
  5. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    I agree Cousins is a head case, but Shaq was too sometimes. Cousins last season was putting up 30/15 with a few assists and blocks some nights... Those are ridiculous numbers.

    I'm with you that ultimately part of me wants a chance at a fresher kid, but Boogie is still only 24 years old. You get him AND the pick? I can't say no to that... Of course our championship will be based off of a less volatile player leading us... Getting Durant might be that much more important with this squad but could also be that much more possible.
     
  6. gcclaker

    gcclaker Moderator Staff Member

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    What JSM said... We have young men who are serious about developing their game, professional and to act as responsible role model adults off of it. Cousins is a talent make no bones about it but the potential headaches aren't worth it. It could infect and divide the locker room. Dwight Howard Redux...
     
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  7. KareemtheGreat33

    KareemtheGreat33 - Lakers MVP -

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    Fun fact: We traded our No. 2 draft pick in 1975 for the greatest center to ever play the game.
     
  8. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    I think I understand the comparison you're drawing, but I don't think it's a good one. Shaq was never ever a "head case". He was a goofball. He was self absorbed. He was often lazy and a challenge to motivate. But he also had the heart of a champion.

    Boogie seems like a legit head case. He is clearly a physical talent like no other 5 in the league today this side of Anthony Davis, and if the right coach gets into his head he may yet become truly great. But, for me, Okafor is already waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay ahead of Boogie in all the internal factors and there is no way I make that trade.

    Again, if Kobe was 30 right now and with Boogie we could make a Ring run, maybe I do it. But that ship has sailed.
     
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  9. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    You would sell your soul to get Stan Johnson. :p:rofl::p
     
  10. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    I think Boogie has a few more screws loose, but motivation is definitely his #1 problem. I'm not saying he'd dominate like Shaq, just that I think when he puts his mind to it he can be- and is- the best Center in the league. It's just a chore to figure him out.

    If we had Phil, it'd be a no brainer to me honestly.

    With Byron it's less obvious. Also like I said, if we're not also getting their pick it becomes a 50/50 deal. I'd have to watch Towns/Okafor in workouts but I think I'd take them over the headcase and make the player we want.
     
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  11. TIME

    TIME Administrator Staff Member

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    No doubt Phil would be the perfect coach for Boogie. I think Boogie might love Byron and play really hard for him, or he might go Sprewell on him.
     
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  12. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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  13. John3:16

    John3:16 Moderator Staff Member

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    So you're suggesting we should trade the #2 for Greg Oden? And all this time I thought we were bringing Bynum back.
     
  14. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    No guarantees, but leaving career threatening injuries out of it (can happen to ANYONE) ...... check below what is said in this link (must read on Okafor for anyone who hasn't) in just this excerpted bit of copy from this link below, and the part especially that I highlighted. As close to a guarantee as needed. Plus what your eyes tell you. We haven't seen his best yet on D I am sure. They wanted him kept in the games and had him playing very conservatively, though granted he's not quick as other defenders.

    http://www.newsobserver.com/sports/college/acc/duke/article14512424.html

    High school coach saw it coming
    The ACC has changed dramatically even since the most recent No. 1 big men played. Brand was dominant at Duke for two seasons before going No. 1 overall in 1999, and Duke coach Mike Krzyzewski first compared the two after Duke’s third game this season, an 81-71 win over Michigan State. Okafor scored 17 points on 8-of-10 shooting.

    “He is probably more skilled than Elton was. Elton was probably more aggressive,” Capel said. “Elton has really good touch, because he was so big and so physical, as far as wide. He had long arms, like Jah. Elton had big hands, too.”

    Okafor’s hands are noticeably large – “When he shook my hand the first time, I was like, ‘What in the hell is that?’ It was like a hand extender,” Slaughter said. They measure 10.25 inches from palm to middle finger, and are nearly a foot wide, 11.25 inches from thumb to pinky finger.

    With hands that big, palming a basketball is easy. Okafor plucks it out of the air like a Skittle, and holding it with one hand allows him to create more space for himself when facing a double-team, as he has often seen this year.

    “A typical big guy, you have your man banging you and trying to push you out by the 3-point line, and another player coming at you,” said Duke assistant Nate James. “(Okafor), somehow, is able to split it and either find someone or make a finger roll or a dunk or something. I have yet to see a big guy do that.

    “I have yet to really see a big man with his feel for the game, his touch. His ability to combine strength with finesse. I have yet to see that in anyone, particularly a freshman. I’ve heard Coach (Krzyzewski) say that Jah is probably the most talented player he has ever coached, at this point. He’s very unique.
     
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  15. Ryanwestlombardi

    Ryanwestlombardi - Rookie -

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    After Mitch see's these guys up close and personal in the upcoming workouts that's when a trade like the one for Cousins will be discussed or flushed. Mitch knows Cousins, his value and flaws,and big contract. If he sees Towns/ Okafur as even close in talent no way he trades for Cousins. Young, talented, high BB IQ, bigs on rookie deals with a positive attitude don't grow on trees.
     
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  16. southbaylakers72

    southbaylakers72 - Rookie -

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    27 is a pick with some value. Getting excited about draft day. Feeling is that Lakers are going to be scary good on paper after draft.
     
  17. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    Me too ^^^
     
  18. alam1108

    alam1108 - Lakers Legend -

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    Let's try not to get cute with things, let's get Okafor/Towns and move on. Like TIME said, if Kobe was younger I'd highly consider trading the pick for Cousins to try and contend next season.
     
  19. Lakerman JSJ

    Lakerman JSJ Moderator Staff Member

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    Agree 100%.

    We're so fortunate to be in a position to land Towns or Okafor. We just need to snag either and go from there.
     
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  20. lakerjones

    lakerjones Moderator Staff Member

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    What JSM said! The ONLY guy I'd do that trade for is Cousins just because his talent is so remarkable. But I've been on the record here blasting him for his attitude and that hasn't changed, IMO. He really is something of a head case.

    I totally agree though with therealdeal - if Phil were here, I think I'd bite on this one. Top 7 pick and Cousins? Whew, hard to resist that one.

    But . . . big caveat as we don't have Phil and I don't think Byron's tough love is the right fit for Cousins. So I wouldn't do it.

    Cousins seems to have major anger issues. Perhaps a troubled childhood or something? Don't know. But that seems to be what's happening to me.
     

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