Julius Randle Discussion: Beast, Ox, Monster, Lotus Flower

Discussion in 'Lakers Discussion' started by DjBelvedere, Oct 7, 2014.

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  1. LakerFanIam

    LakerFanIam - Lakers 6th Man -

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    He looked really bad the first part of Pre Season last year & only came on the last 2 games or so..
    I agree, he looks pretty bad out there, but I'm reserving judgement..
    He always looked a bit awkward in his motions even in college.
     
  2. Lakerman JSJ

    Lakerman JSJ Moderator Staff Member

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    More worried about the quality of our offensive coaching than I am about our young players.

    Having said that, can anyone tell my why Julius absolutely refuses to shoot a mid-range jumper? I've watched all 3 games thus far, and honestly can't remember him ever letting a 15-footer fly. Everything is either a dribble drive or pass. We've heard his J is much-improved, but if he isn't even confident enough to take one in summer league games, I'm more than a little skeptical.

    Hitting a few mid-range J's will make defenders adjust and open up the counter of driving to the hoop even more. Those 2 will compliment each other so well. He's gotta let them fly when he has a good look.
     
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  3. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    I didn't watch the totality yet of Game 3, but so far I think he's taken only one jumper that I'm aware of. I have no idea why he's gone away from it if it's supposedly improved. Heck it looked decent to end Pre-Season last year and yet he's doing nothing with it now. I think it goes to show you how out of sorts he's been in his return.
     
  4. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    It's definitely part of it. For some reason it's not often he finds himself in the mid-post on the wing where he's been clearly the most effective. He's now at the three point line or at the top of the key surrounded by other jerseys.

    Still though, he needs to trust his jumper more and he needs to have his head up while he's driving. For those really, really down on him I'd say watch the 2nd half of both games he's played and skip the first half. He takes a while to get going, but he looks better as the games go on.
     
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  5. fly2thesky0808

    fly2thesky0808 - Rookie -

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    So, i was watching the highlights of Paul Milsap and realized that he should be the player that Randle should model his game after. Randle could be more athletic version of Milsap.

     
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  6. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    millsap and blake griffin. the first step to each's improvement was developing a respectable midrange shot that they weren't afraid to use. they also both do work off the ball to make their lives easier on the catch.
     
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  7. Chillbongo

    Chillbongo - Lakers 6th Man -

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    I re-watched the game vs the Knicks. OK so we all are understanding of the fact that Randle hasn't played 5-5 in ages and he needs to ease back into it to get his timing down, his touch, and even his decision making. Cool - that's expected.

    What I AM concerned about are his poor fundamentals and what seems like stubborness. He keeps doing the same thing over and over. Doesn't box out, ball watches, according to realdeal he sets poor screens and when he does box out its haphazard. Offensively he's a freight train with no driver. I think Bonk nailed it when he said guys have excelled all their lives in AAU and College using their talents and athleticism, so they never needed fundamentals.

    It's coming full circle now, it seems, for Randle. He's going to have to go back to the basics. I did see a bit of hard headedness and stubborness though. Kind of like Kobe, but Kobe HAD the fundamentals from day 1. The work ethic was there.

    I worry that Randle is so irrationally confident (usually a great thing) that he's going to have to hit rock bottom before he builds back up. From the bottom (fundamentals).
     
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  8. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    Here's a Russell right hand. In practice with no defender.

    [​IMG]
     
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  9. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    I saw him do those little things last year though. He boxed out last year, he was more under control, he pulled and hit that jumper towards the end. I mean he looked like a more complete player LAST year... He has those fundamentals he just hasn't displayed them at all so far. His pace is completely off.

    More concerning for me was the body language though. You're right about his stubbornness, but that's got to be earned and he hasn't earned that yet.
     
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  10. tada

    tada - Lakers All Star -

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    I think the fundamentals and discipline will come with time.

    But what I do notice, and this is from last year too, is his body language. It seems like he is either fully engaged or not engaged. It might be his conditioning, but he's always the first one to put his hands on his knees when he goes in a huddle or a play breaks, like so.

    [​IMG]

    He also always seems to lean forward when he ball-watches, as if he has poor eyesight, and kind of looks like he's amazed at what's going on...lol I can't really say if it's a good/bad posture because it's so unique to Julius.

    Anyone else notice this?
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2015
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  11. Chillbongo

    Chillbongo - Lakers 6th Man -

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    I agree - then what's changed? I think he looked LEAGUES better in last year's summer league. He keeps saying his conditioning is not the issue. He goes full steam to the basket when he drives. I haven't noticed what tada pointed out above about spacing out and hands on his knees, but his defensive effort is definitely questionable.

    What could possibly be the reason? Does he not like coach? The system? Is he upset that suddenly he has to compete with 2 young guns for the future of the franchise? I doubt that.

    I agree that he hasn't earned any kind of stubbornness and honestly I want to start Brandon Bass as of right now. Not because I think he's more talented than Randle, because he's not. But because I want Randle to be motivated. He needs to watch film. A LOT of film. He needs to see how bad he looks and then slow down and discipline himself on offense. This is on the coaching staff too. Don't coddle him because he's a prodigy or whatever, bust his a** and create a burning desire in him to improve.

    If he doesn't get motivated by that kind of stuff then I don't know if he's the right fit for the Lakers. I know he is, he just has some maturing to do - both on and off the court.
     
  12. tada

    tada - Lakers All Star -

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    @Chillbongo Honestly I feel like he just needs ALOT more time on the court.

    There's no doubt that Randle's overall game has taken a step back. But he hasn't lost everything. In fact, according to reports, a couple of individual skills like his jumpshot and handling have progressed. And his conditioning is better. He may actually be a better 1-on-1 player than he was last year. However he is much worse as a 5-on-5 player.

    I've read somewhere that he's already watched a ton of film. I think he understands what he needs to do, but he's frustrated because his instincts just aren't there. His rhythm, feel, timing, and spacing aren't in sync with his ideals. Watching film will only widen that gap of reality vs ideal, leading to more overthinking. He needs time on the court, not the film room.

    Every player is different, so it's hard to say when he'll get the 5-on-5 instincts back. I do think it's a gradual process....not an eureka experience.
     
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  13. ShowTime_IR

    ShowTime_IR - Rookie -

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    One thing is for sure, If Randle can't outperform on the court with Kobe who takes double team, a player like Clarkson who takes the opponent attention and a great passer like Russel, he is not gonna do well in this league.
    Add the fact he has less defensive responsibility with Hibbert in play.
     
  14. KB24

    KB24 Administrator Staff Member

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    One thing we need to make sure everyone understands is that Randle is not supposed to become a star. He was the 7th pick of a weak draft. To me, if he is a starter in this league, thats the ceiling.

    I think if he turns into a 15/8 player, thats good success given who he is and what he does and where he was picked. I think people have put too high expectations in him. I have ALWAYS said, even way before summer league, that Randle doesn't seem to be special and honestly, 95% of the players do not, its not a shame. If he becomes Paul Millsap, that would be fantastic.

    Randle is not a franchise player. If he turns into a solid starter, thats completely fine. Thats my expectation.
     
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  15. wcsoldier81

    wcsoldier81 - Lakers All Star -

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    It's going to be process ... coming back from injury , playing in a BS offense with little spacing ...

    The only thing I'm worried about this season for Randle and Russell is Scott crappy offense ... which isn't going to help their development ...

    Some fans need to relax ...
     
  16. tada

    tada - Lakers All Star -

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    I disagree. 'Everyone' needs to understand that a player's potential is not predetermined by draft position. I actually feel he should have been drafted higher, and I disagree with your assessment that 'a #7 pick is not supposed to'become a star.' His draft position has no relevance to what my expectations are. I still see him as the future alpha of the Lakers.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2015
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  17. ShowTime_IR

    ShowTime_IR - Rookie -

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    You are wrong, the Lakers chose him because they thought he would become a star. Kobe said last year that if Randle dosen't succeed in this league with his potential and with the opportunity the team has given him, then he probably really messed it up.
     
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  18. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    It's a good point that his 1 on 1 game is his focus since he's been out so long and his vision and instincts are worse because he hasn't been able to focus on them. He had a whole summer to work on himself, of course he's going to look a little selfish. It's all he's done for a year.

    @Chillbongo I think it's clearly all mental with him. It's all in his head and he wants to do too much. He's not getting the things he thought he would done, so he's getting frustrated. The more frustrated he gets, the worse his body language gets. Instead of getting upset and pouting like he has been, he needs to get upset and work harder. THAT is what we saw last season that ingratiated him with us. Instead of pouting and getting mad when someone else takes the shot, he needs to crash the glass like a beast and go get that rebound. He has all this strength and he's obsessed with using it on drives. Use it on the block. Use it fighting for boards. Use it defensively. You're right he's watched all that film, show him film of how he's playing right now. He looks awful.
     
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  19. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    Finally watched this.

    I'm convinced he's just a frustrated kid right now. Reading between the lines he needs more minutes, but the Lakers aren't letting him play more than 20 minutes a game. It's no wonder he looks much better at the end of games than the start.

    That doesn't excuse him in any way, he needs to also EARN those minutes by playing harder defensively. Still I can see how a young man with an explosive game like his is frustrated to have a leash on him after all this time. I'd hope Kobe could give him a call and tell him to just take a breath. He's come a thousand miles since his injury and he wants to hit the ground going as fast as possible. It's better for him in the long run to take it slower out of the gate.
     
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  20. Chillbongo

    Chillbongo - Lakers 6th Man -

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    It was a good interview. Of course he wants more minutes. Maybe that's what's holding him down. He feels like he's put in a ton of work to rehab the leg, and the coaching staff won't even let him get out there. Maybe that explains the poor body language and behavior.

    Yeah, when I was referring to film watching, I meant to watch film of him NOW. Because he needs to see how ugly it looks and mentally correct those errors. Obviously playing time will help the most but it couldn't hurt to make him see how poor his decision making was the last 3 games.
     
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