Gun Violence Thread

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion and Philosophy' started by therealdeal, Jun 14, 2016.

  1. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    So in light of the current mood and after a little time to sort of gather and reflect here's my stance on the current gun debate:

    1) Let's start here: Banning guns will not happen in the US. It's a non-starter. Too many guns, too many people with guns, it'd be like trying to ban cars.

    2) I am all for more stringent purchasing limitations. You want to raise the legal age? Fine. I have no problem with that. More in-depth background checks? Absolutely. Pass a psych eval? Sure. I'm up for that. There's no reason why such a powerful weapon should be so easy to obtain, it's what leads to people being irresponsible owners. Having a gun comes with weight and responsibility and there should be a sense of responsibility and burden there. Anyone who can just go get a gun easily should not be able to do that.

    3) AR doesn't stand for Automatic Rifle, it stands for Assault Rifle. An Assault Rifle, by manufacturer design, is not an automatic weapon. It is for all intents and purposes, a larger and more powerful semi-automatic pistol. I just wanted to point this out because I hear a lot of uninformed opinions on this, even from people who are gun owners! Let's keep this in mind that there is a distinction. I believe there is no reason to have an automatic weapon as a civilian. An automatic weapon is a weapon only useful to kill someone who is trying to kill you. It is not a useful hunting tool, it is not a useful home defense weapon, it's an impractical recreation weapon.

    4) I do not believe ARs should be banned. I know there are single action hunting rifles out there, but an AR is still a relatively useful hunting weapon and over the last 20 years many people have been hunting with them. I am okay if you want to make this a very difficult weapon to buy, that's fine with me. Again, that's not my concern. A qualified person should be the only one capable of purchasing and carrying a firearm.

    5) Arming the teachers is a cheap measure. People don't go into teaching in order to shoot firearms, keeping firearms near children isn't necessarily the best idea in that setting, and introducing more overt guns into that arena is probably not a good idea. If a teacher wants to be armed, I believe strongly in a carrier's permit being available to any citizen that can pass stringent psychological exams and proves competent. If a teacher feels safer carrying, then they should have that option given the amount of times schools are shot these days. But as a requirement or something? Why? If anything, hire more veterans to defend schools. It could be an easy way for them to make money for a population that we're not servicing enough.

    6) Just a final thought, I'm a gun owner and I was shocked at how easy it was to buy a handgun. I've heard it's easier to buy rifles. I was not required to prove my competency. I was not required to the ins and outs of the gun. I didn't have to pass a competency exam for firing the gun (like a driver's test). I don't think that's right. I think if you're going to put something this powerful out into the world, you should prove your competency both mentally and physically. I also believe more people should be introduced to guns at a young age by responsible people so that they can understand the gravity of what that weapon means and how to take it seriously.

    7) That kid needed help a long time ago. He was on the FBI watch list already. This was a massive failure by the institutions meant to protect us. This isn't a justification for guns at all, just a statement of fact. How do you let that kid buy a gun? If you're being watched by the effing FBI (who said they couldn't find him... did they check his house?), how can you buy a gun? That makes no sense to me.
     
  2. Weezy

    Weezy Moderator Staff Member

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  3. revgen

    revgen - Lakers 6th Man -

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    To expand on this point. According to an ATF report from 2012, there were 347 million guns in the USA. That was 6 years ago.

    The number of bullets is harder to calculate, but estimates range from 10 billion to 40 billion bullets.

    Also, guns and bullets pretty much last forever if stored correctly. Dry, arid environments like the American southwest (AKA Red States like Texas, Nevada, etc) are perfectly suited for keeping guns without worrying about rust or decay.

    I won't even go into the details about 3D printers that can now print aluminum, copper, bronze, and steel and are small enough to sit on an office desk. It's not a matter of if it will be easier to make your own gun at home. It's a matter of when.

    Naive, is the kindest word I can use to describe anybody who thinks a gun ban (AKA gun control) will work.
     
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  4. sirronstuff

    sirronstuff LB Facebook Editor

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    Maybe televise firing squad repercussions for those committing gun violence.

    Pay per view

    Not really. I have no idea what the solution is.
     
  5. LTLakerFan

    LTLakerFan - Lakers Legend -

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    ^^^ For everyone that doesn't coward out and kill themselves or get killed by cops .... I like that a lot. F*** these bastards.
     
  6. John3:16

    John3:16 Moderator Staff Member

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    2 words: molon Labe.

    We're past the point of no return in regards to guns.
     
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  7. davriver209

    davriver209 - Rookie -

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    I’m all for background checks. There are just too many guns out there both legal and illegal to ban them. It’ll be like prohibition all over again...

    Someone here said it, he was on a couple watch lists already, and whatever institutions were in charge of that didn’t act... though, as a person who has been working in law enforcement for the past 5 years, I can understand why he flew under the radar, and why tabs couldn’t be kept on the kid.

    Government is huge, slow, inefficient, I believe get paid decently, but are vastly overworked with not enough staff to keep up with current work. So when the institutions fail, it’s up to society to pick up the slack. We can’t keep expecting institutions to take care of these people by themselves, it’s impossible. Also, if most people didn’t know, acting crazy, being crazy, and saying crazy violent things isn’t a crime... it can def be noted by law enforcement agencies, but as far as taking some sort of action? Negative. All they could do is reference some resources for the family/kid and hope for the best
     
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  8. Barnstable

    Barnstable Supreme Fuzzler of Lakersball.com Staff Member

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    I think it might be Cañada that does this, but why don’t we make it illegal to air the name of anyone that does a shooting? Yes their names will get out by someone online eventually, but take it off of the big news outlets, and make it so people know they will not get famous for being the newest murdering psychopath.

    That might help and I don’t understand why we haven’t done so already.
     
  9. revgen

    revgen - Lakers 6th Man -

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    The 1st amendment makes that impossible. What could happen is that the White House could threaten to remove press passes from organizations that don't comply. Most of the big news organizations want those press passes, so they might comply with those terms.
     
  10. Savory Griddles

    Savory Griddles Moderator Staff Member

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    I think social media is as much to blame for the recent uptick in shootings than anything else. There have been so many studies linking stress, anxiety and depression to social media for obvious reasons. When I talk to the people at my company that are in their early 20's, they are all so much more stressed than I was at that age. Unfortunately that horse is out of the barn as well. As horrible as it is to say, I'm not sure there is anything we can do as a country to make these types of events less likely without becoming a strict, borderline dictatorship. I think there are steps we need to take to keep these events from increasing, but we aren't going to eliminate these things.
     
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  11. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    This is an excellent point.
     
  12. revgen

    revgen - Lakers 6th Man -

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    I've been using twitter since my late 20's. I've never been "stressed out" using it.

    Driving on the freeway stresses me out more than twitter ever has.
     
  13. therealdeal

    therealdeal Moderator Staff Member

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    There are far more stressful social medias than Twitter, including Facebook and Instagram and Snapchat and all the new things.

    The only stressful part of Twitter is the distressing number of stupid people.
     
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  14. davriver209

    davriver209 - Rookie -

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    Haha driving on the freeway in LA is very stressful on oneself...
     
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  15. Azndude2190

    Azndude2190 - Rookie -

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    Other countries have the same kinds of social media, play the same video games and watch the same movies, but don't nearly have the same kind of gun violence that we have in this country. So although these cultural things have a contributing factor, on top of things like the failure of law enforcement and social services; guns and the easy access of guns are still the main issues here.

    That said, I completely agree with it being a non starter if you're hoping to "ban all guns" today. In an ideal world, we would be like Australia, where Columbine happened and we as a country just decided to get rid of all guns. But we aren't and could never be, because we have more guns than people, we have a lot of people, it has been ingrained in our culture since the founding of this country, and it's guaranteed in our constitution.

    However, i'm also completely okay with the idea of making it inconvenient to buy a gun.
     
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  16. ZenMaster

    ZenMaster - Lakers Starter -

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    Non starter? Nah.

    For one, UK did it. For two, start somewhere. Don’t confiscate, for now. Stop selling. Start buying off guns and destroying them.

    Gradually, in 2 - 3 generations, you would be able to start confiscating as well.

    May be in 50 years you get it a little under control.

    But, that’s a non-starter too, I guess. Long term planning and such...
     
  17. Azndude2190

    Azndude2190 - Rookie -

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    Yea like I said, make it hard to get a gun, but it’s completely unrealistic to just say at the start, the solution is to ban all guns and start confiscating those that are already out there.
     
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  18. lakerfan2

    lakerfan2 - Lakers All Star -

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    I'm just going to leave this here for anyone that thought Obama was for banning guns, rather than Gun Control.

    It's just funny how often he or any other Liberal Politician instantly gets lumped into the group that wants to ban or take away guns, when I think it's a very small majority that believes so.
     
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  19. revgen

    revgen - Lakers 6th Man -

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    Yet Obama kept bringing up the "Australian Law" during his speeches.

    LINK

    This Australian law essentially confiscated guns from private owners under the guise of a "gun buyback program". Australians were paid for their guns, but the sales were mandatory. They couldn't refuse to sell their guns back to the Australian government.

    That youtube video was published in 2016. Obama mentions the Australian law in the article above in 2015 after the Charleston shooting. So, he's either lying, flip-flopping, or he doesn't understand how the Australian law worked.
     

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