D'Angelo Russell Discussion: Defense... "That's Not What I Do"

Discussion in 'Lakers Discussion' started by The Original 81, Jun 25, 2015.

  1. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    11,977
    Likes Received:
    18,323
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Professor of Humanities
    Location:
    Orlando
    Offline
    Now it’s about their body type? I hate it when the opposition keeps moving the goalpost. I won’t put Dlo in the company with Giannis or LeBron or Magic. I’ll wait on Simmons and Mitchell. Gobert is an amazing defender. I do think he’s better than Hart, Kuzma, Ingram, and Ball so far. I think my view is pretty clear.

    When is the sample size large enough? The sample size continues to grow and he keeps getting better. I’ve addressed this point previously, and he’s only gotten better.
     
  2. vasashi17

    vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    6,591
    Likes Received:
    20,201
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    I brought up the difference between Zinger and DLo, seeing how both of them were used to dump salary for cap space and certain folks harping on how we didn't get enough of a return in the DLo trade.

    One difference is the guys they were attached to in the dump had value, unless y'all want to make a case for Moz on a 3yr deal being of better value vs Hardaway/Lee on 2yr deals.

    The other obvious differencevus their physical stature. In terms of combo guards..they are a dime a dozen. This isn't something that should miff you. I had no idea DLo was 6'5", so of course I'm not considering him a tall PG. I don't even think Zo is at 6'6", especially when Simmons is in the league and Magic revolutionized the position at his height.

    What makes Zinger special is his height and the fact he can shoot. It's why KG, AD and Giannis are so coveted. It's why he got the unicorn moniker.

    Anyways my beef has never been who's better between Zo and DLo. My beef is with folks tying to insinuate that Magic/Rob's job security is tied to DLo.

    You want to talk about goalposts: let's talk about it. The goal is for thIs FO to make us relevant asap. DLo doesn't fit that narrative, even if he didn't have a checkered past here. It's why most of our kids either have been made available or are now available for win-now stars.

    Folks bring up all-star as a means to quantify the level of f*** up by our FO, which is why I need to undermine his selection pointing out key injuries/trades and strength of conference. But I'm certain if you put some of our kids in the east (before it got stronger at the deadline) and play them at high usage, they would be all-star candidates too.

    The Nets are 6th in the east and with their record out west would be 10th. Meanwhile the 6th team in the West has no all-star candidates to their name...which is why I brought up Spida (another scoring combo guard btw) and Gobert.

    Anyways, the FO found a way to get out of a 3yr nearly 50m deal...and they attached DLo to it (a guy that tarnished his own value with the Swag nonsense). Let's say, they held off on that deal and tried to clear room for Bron when he committed to us...what's to say BK would accept the deal then, especially if DLo had an injury plagued season again?
     
  3. Weezy

    Weezy Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    17,869
    Likes Received:
    72,565
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Anaheim
    Offline
    I mean, it was impressive, and his last 12 in a comeback win to close it out was great, but I’m also gonna he that guy, it wouldn’t have happened in LA. He took 31 shots (officially, not counting free throw shots, so probably 34 really), and 15 threes. He doesn’t get those shots in LA, especially next to LeBron. I’m happy for the kid, but he said being traded from LA was the best thing to ever happen to him and I believe him. There’s something rotten in our culture, in our front office, in our player development, somewhere in there, and players aren’t finding the success they are elsewhere aside from like Kuzma who came here more ready made as an older player out of college. So yes, I’m happy for Russ, I’m glad to see his career take off because the failure rate of #2 picks is sad to me, but I’m not lamenting is trading him because it seems to be the thing that propelled him to where he is.
     
    gcclaker, abeer3, wallangong and 4 others like this.
  4. KB24

    KB24 Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Messages:
    3,159
    Likes Received:
    8,286
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Certified Tax Advisor
    Location:
    Germany
    Offline
    I don't care about the stats too much. But the Nets are winning and he is a big part of the winning formula...AND his stats are picking up.

    But most importantly he is the best player on the Nets right now and they benefit from it in the W-L column.
     
    abeer3, trodgers and tada like this.
  5. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    11,977
    Likes Received:
    18,323
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Professor of Humanities
    Location:
    Orlando
    Offline
    There was a long term and a short term plan. They punted on the long term plan, and that’s fine. But they had better get something good for all that cap room, or it’s a failure. It’s not about lamenting the loss of Russ because he’s near and dear to your heart. It’s about giving young players a chance to develop and pulling the plug too soon on some and way too late on others.
     
    gcclaker, abeer3, revgen and 3 others like this.
  6. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    16,172
    Likes Received:
    31,056
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    The arguments here are laughable. I don't even respond to them because it takes away from the quality of the thread.

    I guess if we drafted Okafor everyone would have been happy, right?

    He can make 10 more All-Star appearances, the Lakers could strike out for the next 10 years in Free Agency, and there will ALWAYS be a contingent of anti Russell fans justifying the trade.
     
    trodgers and abeer3 like this.
  7. Weezy

    Weezy Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    17,869
    Likes Received:
    72,565
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Anaheim
    Offline
    I didn’t say anything that disagrees with this. In fact I agree with all of it.

    Really? Anti-Russell fans? [​IMG] I don’t think there’s a contingent of anti-Russell fans here, at most there’s a few people like me saying being traded to NY was what he needed to get truly motivated to become what he has. I can’t recall anyone really hating the kid aside from a few making jokes about his “snitching” incident, and he was my favorite Laker when he was here, I defended him a lot.
     
    The Showtime Mamba and trodgers like this.
  8. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    16,172
    Likes Received:
    31,056
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    Thought this was pretty cool - GoldenThroat on LG aka Lakers Film Room aka Pete Zayas on Russell

    Somebody asked if they predicted if this is where he thought Russell would be at this age and his response

    "This is about where I would've expected him to be with a good coach/system. His passing/ball-handling has improved a lot this year based on what I've seen, with him making fewer dumb mistakes and having a better feel for when to make some of his flashier passes.

    I underestimated his ability to get white hot a bit though. I knew he had that in him, but I didn't think he'd be able to access that as frequently as he has recently. If he's doing that this frequently at 22, he's gonna be a handful at 25-27.

    I think the next step for him is learning how to use his physicality to draw more free throws."
     
    sirronstuff, abeer3 and trodgers like this.
  9. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    16,172
    Likes Received:
    31,056
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    RE: Russell's comment on not being a Laker anymore...

    "Of course he's glad he's no longer a Laker. We've got our heads so far up our own a**** that people were like "he better shape up or else the Lakers are gonna ship him out!" like that's a bad thing."
     
    sirronstuff, abeer3 and trodgers like this.
  10. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    16,172
    Likes Received:
    31,056
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    So much more commentary; I'll post a scouting report he had 2 years ago; Russell is my favorite prospect out of everybody we have drafted, and I'm admittedly bias.

    Kid had so much working against him; glad he's an overcomer...
     
  11. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    25,705
    Likes Received:
    69,920
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    but fox hole and bro code and such...

    QED
     
  12. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    11,977
    Likes Received:
    18,323
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Professor of Humanities
    Location:
    Orlando
    Offline
    23-8-7 and a win against the Spurs.
     
    sirronstuff and LaVarBallsDad like this.
  13. Doc Brown

    Doc Brown - Lakers Starter -

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2014
    Messages:
    2,571
    Likes Received:
    11,517
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Doctorin'
    Location:
    Hill Valley
    Offline
    Any chance we could get him for a few games?
     
    shoe and trodgers like this.
  14. LaVarBallsDad

    LaVarBallsDad - Lakers Legend -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    16,172
    Likes Received:
    31,056
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    Damn, man. F*** me.
     
    trodgers likes this.
  15. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    11,977
    Likes Received:
    18,323
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Professor of Humanities
    Location:
    Orlando
    Offline
    I think Luke is the problem.
     
    LaVarBallsDad likes this.
  16. Kenzo

    Kenzo - Lakers All Star -

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    7,405
    Likes Received:
    15,567
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Poland
    Offline
    It all started with b0ron. Magic just listened to his buddy and here we are :p
     
  17. KB24

    KB24 Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Messages:
    3,159
    Likes Received:
    8,286
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Certified Tax Advisor
    Location:
    Germany
    Offline
    No, we need someone who is a leader!

    -Magic-

    Lonzo is leading the Lakers, usually from the Alter-G anti-gravity treadmill.
     
  18. Doc Brown

    Doc Brown - Lakers Starter -

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2014
    Messages:
    2,571
    Likes Received:
    11,517
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Doctorin'
    Location:
    Hill Valley
    Offline
    - Love for vets (even when playing poorly)
    - Short leash for young players (even when playing well)
    - Poor recognition of game flow (Leaves bad lineups out there too long while leads grow)
    - Poor rotation management (Has no sense of who plays well with each other)
    - Gameplans (offense/defense what exactly are we doing 60 games into the season, still waiting for any semblance of improvement)
    - Assistant coach at best, in over his head as head coach
     
    alam1108 and trodgers like this.
  19. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2014
    Messages:
    25,705
    Likes Received:
    69,920
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Offline
    thought luke was pretty good last year. i think it's basically impossible to coach a lebron/rondo team. i think he's been under order to keep vets happy (or lose his job). he should have realized he's going to lose his job anyway, so he should go out his way.

    as for what they're doing, it's not what he wants, imo. he's clearly articulated how he would prefer to play, but he's been given very few players who can/want to play that way. should he be more flexible? i suppose. i think he's trying, but his heart's not in it.

    anyway, guys getting beat on routine back cuts every 5th trip down isn't on the coach. he pulls those guys, and their replacements just replicate the performance.

    byron was objectively terrible. i think luke is ok and will have success elsewhere, first as an assistant and then as a head coach. when he was hired, it was thought to be a pretty long rebuild, and he might have been the right choice for that. now it's not.
     
    Kenzo and trodgers like this.
  20. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    11,977
    Likes Received:
    18,323
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Professor of Humanities
    Location:
    Orlando
    Offline
    I did think he was being brought in for a long rebuild. Then magic seemed to have changed the terms. He didn’t deal in good faith.
     

Share This Page