D'Angelo Russell Discussion: Defense... "That's Not What I Do"

Discussion in 'Lakers Discussion' started by The Original 81, Jun 25, 2015.

  1. Punk-101

    Punk-101 - Lakers Starter -

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    Selling your soul for capspace to sign LeDouche and yet to be landed superstar better be worth it, Magic.
     
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  2. KareemtheGreat33

    KareemtheGreat33 - Lakers MVP -

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    it would be...
     
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  3. Kou

    Kou - Lakers 6th Man -

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    50/40/90 is what hurts right now, hopefully he can keep it up, they went from 9-18? To 26-23, pretty remarkable.
     
  4. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    yeah, if any a-list star (basically durant, klay thompson, kawhi, or kyrie) signs here this summer, maglinka win and i'm an idiot ranting on the internet. short of that, should have just cleared one max slot like most sensible teams.
     
  5. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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    I think it's more complicated, but I think Thompson is a Laker. What if he joins up, but LeBron fades a bit and the Lakers don't win a ring in the LBJ tenure?

    LeBron's missed games:
    First four seasons: 12
    Second four seasons: 17
    Third four seasons: 44
    This four seasons: 28 and counting

    He has had tremendous health and consistency, but he's 34. I've been there. I know how little bumps and bruises can build. Everybody knows LeBron can play at an elite level (on offense) still, but for how long and how frequently? This is a long game, and let's see what happens with all these players involved over the next ten years. Tons of moving pieces - DAR, Ball, Fox, Kuzma, Hart, and even Randle.
     
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  6. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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    He’s a very different player from two years ago. Highlights from last game at the link.
     
  7. vasashi17

    vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

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    This post coming with 1 dope month from DLo. This isn't real life haha.

    Sold our souls? Nah, we sold on a player thats had off court issues, had injury plagued seasons and hasn't really accomplished anything yet, for a guy that has had a microscope on him since 18 and hasn't (publicly) slipped, hasn't had season debilitating injuries and is a 3x champion.

    1 month of (n)ice and y'all losing your minds. Kudos to the kid tho, but our souls are just fine without him.

    Btw, here's the real perception of All-star comparing the star heavy west to the star Dipoleted east.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Notice any similarities on where both Zo and DLo rank...but we sold our zouls.

    Y'all stay wild.
     
  8. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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    Speak it. D Wade is killing it! Glad to see a voice of reason.

    That’s called sarcasm. You can do better, V!
     
  9. vasashi17

    vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

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    Wade through the results tho...

    If fan voting is an outlier, Zo among his peers was picked 14th among 30 potential guards in the West (2 guards per 15 teams). DLo was 10th.

    Even the sycophantic media showed no love: picked Zo 6th among western guards, while DLo was picked 8th overall.

    But hey, even if Dlo makes all-star in a lawless Wall-less Dieepo-less east, it wouldn't be Dragic, uh tragic...dude is helping a LeVert-less Nets team to some success. There's no Love lost...but here's the Zing, uh thing...I ain't mad if he's an allstar....just mad that I have no soul for thinking dude was an easy sacrifice for Bron.
     
  10. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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  11. Punk-101

    Punk-101 - Lakers Starter -

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    Only worth it for BRon+.
     
  12. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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    A look at All-Star voting...

    PLAYERS
    Lonzo received 10 votes.
    Russell received 15 votes.

    FANS
    Lonzo received 961,488 votes. But Rondo got 222k, Hart 209k, KCP 77k, Lance 151k, Svi 20k, Bonga 14k, and Caruso 10k. Leaving out LeBron, Kuzma received 1.2m, Ingram 448k, McGee 316k, Beasley 56k, Zubac 97k, Chandler 79k, Williams 12k, and Wagner 21k.

    Russell received 222,499 fan votes, very nearly the same as all other Brooklyn players combined, at all positions.

    It's almost like people voted more for the Lakers than Brooklyn.

    MEDIA
    Lonzo received 0 votes.
    Russ received 0 votes.

    You can draw the conclusion that Lonzo and Russ were equally "praised" in this equation, but I have no idea what that's supposed to mean in terms of worthiness for the ASG.
     
  13. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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    No Dinwiddie possibly for a few games. His ability to penetrate and carry the O outside DAR has been key to their success. Three possibiiities: Russ goes hero, Napier steps up, or the offense utterly crumbles.
     
  14. vasashi17

    vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

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    Trav, I brought up All-star not to undermine your guy....he's obviously killing it right now and with the Dinwiddie injury, he's now completely in charge of that Nets team.

    I only brought up Allstar cause public perception is a MFer. Compared to the West, outside of Ky, the East is devoid of star guards. So you'd expect with all the recent hype BK is getting, that the Allstar returns would display DLo obliterating the likes of Ball. Instead they're comparable and that's excluding the fan vote. Players are just as likely to pick Ball as they are DLo and it's entirely wild that the media is hyping up the BK resurgence, yet voted DLo in last as an Allstar among his peers.

    So as much as DLo has been killing it of late, a rouge pessimistic Laker crowd has looked at the DLo trade to open up cap for Bron as a misstep...and that's just a crazy perception to have no matter how much you admire DLo's recent outburst.
     
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  15. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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    I think the disagreement is about two things. First whether moving D-Lo to get the space was necessary. Many believe - and have demonstrated, I think - that it wasn’t. Second whether D-Lo was the player Magic said he was. He isn’t, and that’s clear.
     
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  16. vasashi17

    vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

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    Our books would read as such heading into the 2018 free agency summer without any trades/waives/RFA renouncements

    Deng 18
    Moz 16
    JC 12.5
    Jules 12.4
    Zo 7.5
    DLo 7
    BI 5.8
    Nance 2.3
    28th pick (Kuz or Hart) 1.6
    Zu 1.5
    incomplete roster charge of 2 = 1.8

    = 86.4m (with the salary cap set @ 101.9m, our cap space = 15.5m)

    30%max = 30.6m, 35%max (like Bron) = 35.7m

    So we'd need to clear roughly 20m+ to gain enough cap space to max out Bron.

    Stretching MozDeng would have opened up close to 20m, but that still leaves 14m per in dead cap over the next 5 seasons (vs 5m over 3yrs that we're currently in with the Deng buyout). Also that would clear 2 more roster spots, so our incomplete roster charge would reflect another 1.8m in lost cap space. So again, not enough cap space for Bron.

    Now I agree with you that DLo could have been left out in the dump and instead Zo or BI could have been involved. Also the JC/Nance trade wasn't really necessary if Jules was going to walk regardless and/or a 2nd max guy wasn't necessary to lock in Bron (which is why you understand my deep ire for Mintz/Paula).

    I criticize Magic for giving up on TB too soon, not making more of a push to lock up BLo and not holding Jules captive as a restricted free agent...but we needed the cap space for Bron and you can't ignore that DLo was a distressed asset. He was immature while he was here and his stats while he was here did not attribute to us being competitive.

    As far as Magic being wrong on DLo being a good leader...even with the impressive 6 week run he's on, its still TBD. And the same can be said for Zo, since both those dudes have really just "led" their respective teams to being largely irrelevant.
     
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  17. abeer3

    abeer3 - Lakers Legend -

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    soooo....you actually kind of agree with me. got it.

    bottom line is that lebron was possible without the dlo trade.

    but in reality (and again), i wanted dlo moved for an allstar, just like i want all of our current guys moved for an allstar. i'm consistent. i hate cap space. even after it netted lebron (who's worrying me at this point, quite frankly).
     
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  18. tada

    tada - Lakers All Star -

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    We can't be certain that Lebron would have signed if we had less flexibility.
     
  19. vasashi17

    vasashi17 LB's Resident Capologist

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    But DLo was moved for an allstar....BLo, remember?

    Seriously tho, like tada said, you just don't know if Bron would have came to LA by himself when he didn't do that in taking his talents to Miami and the Land re-up. In fact, dude was moonlighting with Zo for nearly the entire year, so maybe that #2 pick wasn't an option to use in dumping Moz.

    And no, Im not saying it was possible to bring in Bron without trading DLo...a salary dump was absolutely necessary. What I'm saying is that DLo could have been the asset subbed out from the Moz package.

    But there was the whole Nick Young thing, followed by liking an anti-Zo tweet...so that was the working impression Magic had to deal with, before making a decision. And considering BI's 2way potential, there is no way I choose to include BI instead of DLo in a Moz dump.

    I still do this trade over and over again, since we're still in position for a max player next summer and packaging our leftover kiddies in a potential AD trade.

    Had we stretched MozDeng and had nearly 15% of or cap taken up with dead money, then you can forget any of those 2019 possibilities.
     
  20. trodgers

    trodgers Administrator Staff Member

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    Russ struggled - 4 TOs, 4 PFs, played only 24 minutes.

    Here's the thing, though, about suggesting it's just "one month."

    Russ has averaged 17.4 points, 5.8 assists, and 3.9 rebounds across 97 games with the Nets (in under 28 MPG).
    In 49 games this season, those are up to 19.2 points, 6.4 assists (in 29.6 MPG).
    In his last 40 games, he's at 20.2 points, 6.7 assists (and 44.4% FGs, 37.3% 3pts, 81.4% FTs)

    He had a down game, but he was still a +4, shot 45.5%, and the Nets won.
     

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